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This is probably one that just needs a simple one-off answer: I have been searching for the appropriate LGBTQ+ flag. Searching the internet is confusing and full of misleading options. What is the right flag for crossdressers. I am married and hetero (and so feel lesbian when dressed…. which is most of the time, but I am also possibly transgender). Is there a specific flag for my situation? Are there indeed different flags for different crossdressing profiles? Or do we all simply fall under the transgender flag (which by the way I really quite like).
Sorry if this topic has already been discussed.
Brussels pride march is coming up soon and I would like to show my proper colours.
Thanks and hugs
Christine
@christineth Why do we need a flag Christine? We are who we are. And generally loving it xx.
@chrisfp99 Chrissie, you are perfectly correct. But it helps rally the girls and announces to the world that we are proud of who we are.
Hugs
Christine
@chrisfp99 This is really complicated. For me flags came about to rally troops in battle, so they knew their own side and wouldn’t get lost. Later they assumed a semi mystical nature, it was the ultimate disgrace to lose a colour to the enemy, and old ones were “laid to rest’ in cathedrals to moulder away as it they were living things. They have become national symbols and sources of pride and an expression of patriotism - People swear allegiance to the ‘flag and the constitution’ of the USA to become citizens of that nation.
I can see therefore why people adopt them and want to use them to express an identity. However, the flip of the coin is that ‘otherness’. We are different. We are on our own. We are exclusive. We are not YOU.
I’ll be honest at the risk of having noses put out of joint as a result. I don’t think I am any part of the LGB bit, and as I consider myself a hetero cis male who happens to need to/enjoy expressing myself by dressing as the opposite sex, I am not sure I sit comfortably with the Trans part either. I am rather uncomfortable with the ‘Pride’ flag. It’s a political flag representing a particular take that perhaps doesn’t always sit well for me. I have watched Pride marches in London. The first I saw was still called ‘Gay Pride’ in 1987. It’s great if some enjoy it. I am not knocking that, but I have seen stuff on it that I cannot endorse, but I am not gay. I don’t necessarily understand the frame of reference, values and the challenges individuals in that community face, and I can’t. I don’t feel it’s a banner I would fly for myself.
I agree with you in your earlier post. Why would I want a ‘flag’ to show my ‘otherness’? I want to be treated as me. Until recently that me was entirely male presenting. I can’t see me going out dressed ever but if that changed I would not want people to look at me as ‘other’ than what I am.
I am far from certain that a Cross Dressing Pride flag is needed. Where does all this end? What about a sub flag for the cross dressing Drag Queen sorority? Or the fetishist CD? We end up with ever more atomised and individual communities vying to show themselves, and the ultimate thing (which is true of course) is we end up as individuals on our own rather than a community of interest.
Love to all, and apologies if I have inadvertently caused offence.
@chrissieprice984340 Gosh Chrissie, what an eloquent and beautiful post. Thank you xx.
@chrissieprice984340 Very good points.
I suppose we’re part of the larger LGBTQIA+ community, because we do experience gender fluidity. And we do need to stick together for the same reasons as our LGBT friends: We’re a fringe minority who are easily maligned.
But before we create any flags, I would be happy just to have a fully fledged seat at the LGBT table. I tried to reach out to a local LGBT center here and received no responses whatsoever. Maybe we’re not “different enough”.
(Besides, I always thought the original rainbow flag was already intended to include absolutely everyone.)
@shannonhyde I think your last point is key; the Rainbow flag was intended for everyone. There are now additional stripes and logos on it, representing other ‘minorities’ which I think is gilding the lily.
For me personally, I think of myself as a cis-heterosexual male, who has discovered an enjoyment from presenting as a female in as convincing a way as possible. I do not feel I can lay claim to the Lesbian, Gay or BI labels at all. Dressed in drab or as Christina I am not same-sex attracted, nor am I seeking partners either AMAB or AFAB, other than my GG wife with whom thankfully I share all this wonderful world. (Alright, in my fantasy world Christina is actually a gay woman, but that’s as real as me being an astronaut in the fancy dress competition I won in 1969 aged 3!)
For me to claim these identities is sort of ‘cultural appropriation’ for me, I do not feel I can own them. I have never experienced the life, frustrations and joys of those communities and understand them only as one understands and sympathises with other human beings in general if one has their welfare genuinely at heart. Thus I could not be represented by the Rainbow flag of Pride, even if I did not have some reservations about the politics of identity.
Likewise I would not claim the Trans status either. My desires are skin deep. I love to dress up and look like a woman. I sincerely hope one day I can look as good as many on this site (yourself included) who can easily pass as female. I hope that eventually I can learn to behave naturally as a female and speak in a better female voice than I can at present, & I would like to venture forth in the world as Christina and be accepted as her although that might never happen. I do not claim to actually want to be a female. I respect all those who feel HRT and surgeries are what they need to truly be what they feel they are, but I do not wish either for myself. I am happy as a male, and were I to transition wholly to the female role I think I would be denying a whole chunk of who and what I am and have been since birth. I would I think be as unhappy in my skin as I realised my male alter ego was without realising it in the years before Christina struggled into the light.
Personally I feel I am super-binary rather than non-binary. I derive great power from my two sides of what I am, male and the feminine and love the compare and contrast. I don’t seek to wear gender neutral stuff, although no doubt often do wear it (sports gear, slob clothing for days off!😂) I definitely look male as G——-, and I hope I shall be getting more feminine as Christina as I go on. So I feel I can’t claim the Trans flag either.
Reading the pages here shows to me that the cross dressing community is massively diverse with everyone having their own individual desires needs and expectations. That is definitely a strength but I question why we might need a ‘CD’ flag, as Chrissie Smith posted. As you say, for those who can own it, the LBG part of our sisterhood, there is the Rainbow flag; for those who identify as trans or non binary or gender fluid, really they are already represented in the Rainbow flag or the Trans flag according to preference, and I am there on the sidelines applauding their choice and defending it. It just isn’t something I would be comfortable doing myself as things stand at the moment.
Once again I have tried to be sensitive in my use of language and clear about my thoughts but I apologise to anyone in any community if I have inadvertently offended.
hugs
Christina ❤️❤️❤️
@ellyd22 Thanks Elly. With so much going on in the world and the haters hating, I wondered if I had been right to post, so I truly thank you from the bottom of my heart hon.
love and kisses ❤️❤️❤️💋💋💋
Christina
What you wrote was genuinely reflective, well thought-out and eloquently stated.
So ... thank you!
Ellie x
@shannonhyde Hey Shannon, that’s sad that you did not get any response from your local LGBT centre….I suspect that the ‘mainstream’ LGBT community also see us as ‘strange’…just as much as the outwardly straight community. We are, I do feel sometimes, the last marginalised group. Hugs Christine
@christineth - sounds like a great idea for a CDH competition.
The trans crowd have their flag - but I'm not sure that covers people who consider themselves 'just' crossdressers.
Maybe something heraldic in nature?
A chameleon flanked by a lipstick tube on one side and a mascara wand on the other,?
It could even be set on a yin and yang background symbolising opposing but interconnected and interdependent forces. Yin - associated with passivity, femininity, coolness, and the Earth.associated with activity and masculinity.
The possibilities are endless!
@sunnyday Hey Alli, great suggestions. How would one go about making it a competition on CDH? Hugs Christine
Even as a crossdresser, I have always considered myself to be part of the transgender spectrum. As with anything, there are degrees of transgender and crossdressers are at one end of that spectrum. As a result, I see myself under the transgender flag.
Have a wonderful time at Pride....Brussels is such a nice city!
@lauren114 Lauren, thanks. Brussels in indeed nice….as long as its not raining. I should probably invest in a transgender flag umbrella. Hugs Christine
I think the transgender flag is the closest you'll get. I'm not aware of a flag for crossdressers.
/LK
@lizk Liz, that is what I’m thinking. And of course I am happy and proud to be part of the transgender community. Hugs Christine.
There isn't a specific CD flag.
I use the trans flag 🙂
🏳️⚧️
This was designed by American trans woman Monica Helms, and first used at a Pride march in Phoenix, Arizona in 2000.
This was Helm's own explanation of the flag: 'The stripes at the top and bottom are light blue, the traditional colour for baby boys. The stripes next to them are pink, the traditional colour for baby girls. The stripe in the middle is white, for those who are intersex, transitioning or consider themselves having a neutral or undefined gender.'
Ellie x
Ellie,
I've an idea. Let's CREATE OUR OWN....It may not be universal but it could be our "CDH FLAG"...We have a massive following. We have the luxury of idea collection....PLUS, YOU, Dr Ellie are an established ARTIST. Ellie "Betsy Ross" "Don't call me Jefferson" Davis.
Tell me what you think.
Sincerely and With Love,
Thea
Nevertheless,
@theapat Great idea Thea.
Crossdressers stand tall,
A flag of pride waves gently—
Freedom for us all.
Maybe we could make a competition with proposals from the CDH community
Hugs
Christine
@ellyd22 The Crossdressing flag feature a saltire upon a hot pink and vibrant blue field, where half of the saltire is hot pink (and placed upon the vibrant blue field), and the other half is vibrant blue (and placed upon the hot pink field).
The cross represents the “crossing” that takes place during cross-dressing, and how the two traditional genders intersect each other and continue to exist during cross-dressing.
@leslienix I looked up the saltire X flag and read the description. I have never seen it before, but I like it.
@leslienix I always considered the trans flag to be for CDs too, but I'm not trans, I think, so it's not perfect. I like this saltire flag and the description of its design, but I'm not a fan of the brightness of the colors. Blend in is the advice most often given to girls asking about how to dress when they go out for the first time, and these colors don't do that. I think this flag, but with the colors of the trans one, would be perfect CD flag.
@astrosteve Stephanie, you know I had exactly the same thought about the colours of the saltire flag. I would have also preferred the soft pink and baby blue colours.
Hugs
Christine
@ellyd22 Thanks Ellie, interesting historical insight into the transgender flag. Interestingly, whilst the blue and pink are now for boys and girls respectively in Belgium, just one generation or so ago, it was the reverse: pink for boys and blue for girls. Hugs Christine
@ellyd22 I'm with you, sister. The trans flag is most appropriate, but we rock the pride flag at home because our family is queer AF. All of us, really. 3 generations. If there's a freak flag, we fly it! 😅
There isn't a dedicated flag for crossdressers.
I wonder if we are even part of the LGBTQ+ community. Most of us are not homosexual. Crossdressers are not trans. We sit on the very edge of the circle. Obviously, we are close allies, but I don't think that we are part of the community.
Both a gay friend, and a trans friend have said that they are willing to let me into the "club" as a +1 🙂
Cerys
You can find it using the following search terms: 'Flag Library Pride Crossdresser'.
(Note: post edited to remove direct link)
@leslienix Leslie, thanks. It seems quite representative and logical. Do other girls know this flag?
Hugs
Christine
@leslienix There are a few different flags, not an official one AFIK. The saltire seems to be the most popular, but there are others.
Cerys
@dazzler Hey Cerys, that is probably why I am confused…there being several options and none of them official. \Hugs
Christine
I like the one that Leslie unearthed - especially the logic behind the design - but it doesn't appear on most listings of LGBTQ+ flags. It would be great if there was a single 'official' flag 🙂
To be honest, there are so many flags in existence that it can be quite hard to keep up.
When I was in Manchester in early December with @jacquelinelarkspur we were talking to a lesbian couple from Leeds. During the Leeds Pride event last July they were having to resort to Google Lens in order to try and identify all the different flags that were on display.
Ellie x
@ellyd22 Ellie, I couldn’t agree more…why do things get so complex so quickly. I think we could consider to make “FLAG” Fashion, Lifestyle And Glamour our motto and not worry too much about an actual flag.
Having said that I am probably going to buy both the transgender flag and the mixed blue and red X flag.
Hugs
Christine
@dazzler You make a very good point, we are not really accepted as LGBTQ+, nor Trans. I think in some ways we are the last taboo, as everything else is little by little being accepted.
@cardigangirl Cardigangirl, I agree we are the “last taboo”. And because of that, we should join the wider community to help gain acceptance for us.
Hugs
Christine
@dazzler Cerys, I agree that we are not all trans, nor homosexual, but is still think we are or should be part of the LGBTQ+ community. I think we need the movement to help us gain wider acceptance.
Hugs Christine
We use the trans flag because for many CD'ing is just another niche on the trans spectrum.
@d44 hi Fiona,
I couldn't agree more. The world is full of spectrums, I'll never be full on trans, but I'm happy to be in the transmix.
Ok crikey ! Have I just come up with a new word 😉
Emma x
@emmat Don’t let transmix become a liability—turn it into profit today! Contact Altiras Fuels now to get a quote and maximize your fuel asset recovery!...wonder if they have a flag? 🤣
I think we are our own flag. We may dress in different colours but those who venture out represent our own diversity of crossdressers. Flags can be divisive so wear your own with pride...
@ab123 i agree i think we are our own flag your post brought to mind a line from a song territories by rush better the pride that resides in a citizen of the world than the pride that divides when a colorful rag is unfurled
