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Labels, Good or Bad

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Posts: 263
Lady
Topic starter
(@veroslondon)
Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Joined: 1 year ago

It seems common for moderators of CD forums such as CDH to discourage the use and discussion of labels mostly to try and avoid divisive and inflammatory discourse. I generally sympathise with this approach because CDH and its sister sites should be a haven from the vitriol of your typical social media site. However, I think there are situations when labels can help us understand a little better what it means (and what it doesn't mean) to be a CD and I have a couple of examples from my own experience.

The expression cross-dresser is of course a label which CDH is happy to use in it's name but when I was becoming an adolescent in the UK in the 1960's and my CD inclinations were beginning to blossom I couldn't put a name to what I was. I remember seeing a BBC show about April Ashley who was a famous transgender model at the time and being slightly alarmed that I was transgender and I might need to undergo a sex change. It wasn't until a few years later that I first saw the word "transvestite" and this was a real light bulb moment for me. A bit of research in the local library (remember the 1960's were well before the internet) and I realised that a transvestite was exactly what I was, that being a TV wasn't that unusual and that I wasn't a freak. Although now having a label for what I was, didn't exactly get rid of all the doubts and anxieties (it was the 1960's!) it did provide a small degree of comfort I didn't have before.

Also, in a recent post I asked if other CDH members had experienced feelings of autogynephilia (AGP) which based on some of your replies I now know is a controversial label and concept although I wasn't aware of this until recently. However, in what I think was a measured debate a number of members responded that the idea of self-desire is something that resonates with them and is not an abnormal part of being a CD. Again, I took some comfort from there being a label for my feelings and that others out there experienced them as well.

Now I'm not advocating a label free-for-all but in some circumstances I think labels are a useful short-hand for helping us to deal with the daily complexities of being a CD. 

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47 Replies
8 Replies
Baroness
(@river)
Joined: 1 year ago

Noble Member     New Hampshire, United States of America
Posts: 827

@veroslondon The issue for me with labels like autogynephilia and Transvestite. is most dont know what the words that make up these labels mean , and that causes confusion and confusion can lead to hate. Anyone that does not know what Cross Dresser means is.. well I wont use the label im thinking of lol.. I dont need more sub categories inside the CD bucket to seperate people any further.  Im sure weather your autogynephilia , TV , TG, CD or you identify as a toad. no one here gives a 🐀🫏  were all sisters, brothers. .and Non binary Siblings.  There are too many differences between all people to have so many very specific buckets to further seperate everyone.   My 2 cents 🐸 Cheers RC

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Managing Ambassador
(@lizk)
Joined: 5 years ago

Illustrious Member     North County San Diego, California, United States of America
Posts: 3859

@veroslondon 

I want to address this for everyone's benefit.

Labels are freely tossed around CDH every day. I don't have a problem with that, and I think I can safely say that goes for the rest of the CDH staff. There is a long list of labels you can choose in your profile. Any of them is okay to use or discuss anywhere and anytime on the site. Nobody is going to bust you for having a discussion such as this one.

However, context matters. If a label is used to divide or inflame, it WILL be an issue.

I personally don't like the label 'transvestite', and avoid using it whenever possible. But that's me. If you want to use that label or have a discussion about it, knock yourself out.

But if you say 'transvestite' shouldn't be used because of 'Reason A' or 'Reason B', you will probably start a flame war. Then staff gets involved.  We don't want that.

One last thing. Please don't use or discuss labels that are off-limits on the site. You've all seen them. They're the ones used to describe various kinks and fetishes, or are considered offensive by most members of the transgender community. CDH isn't the place for stuff like that.

Happy labeling!

/EA

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(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@emilyalt Hi Emily

If only life were that simple but I do get your point and I try to abide by the rules but until recently I didn't realise that some people think the word autogynephilia/c is a term of abuse.

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Lady
(@raven188)
Joined: 6 years ago

Prominent Member     Idaho, United States of America
Posts: 507

@veroslondon 

Labels are interesting. I think the biggest downside is that when you assign or accept a label, it can discard or ignore other aspects of identity. Yes, I'm a cross dresser, but no, I'm not trans, but nonbinary feels like a good label, but I'm also a whole bunch of other things that have nothing to do with gender.

The good thing about labels, though, is that they can help us think about our experience and our selves. As you said, they can help us not feel like freaks (though, being freaky IS kind of fun). I remember watching a comedy sketch by Eddie Izzard (a comedian who often cross dressed during his shows, though now has come out as trans and prefers feminine pronouns, so "her" shows, though she was a he when this particular show was done so . . . ?) and he/now she said something like, "male lesbians like me" and I remember thinking, "yes!, that seems to fit. I'm a guy who doesn't always feel like a traditional guy, but always likes women." I think about the friendships I've had with women, and men over the years and I think I probably have a lot in common with many lesbians. I never quite feel like I fit in with the guys, seem to more naturally be able to talk to women, love women's styles and clothing, and am only sexually attracted to women.

I think the most important thing to remember is that any label is always only part of a person.

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(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@raven188 Hi Sarah

 

I assume you are aware that one of the issues womens' groups are campaigning for is that trans women should be barred from lesbian dating sites. So you may want to reconsider whether you want to be known as a male lesbian!

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Lady
(@raven188)
Joined: 6 years ago

Prominent Member     Idaho, United States of America
Posts: 507

Yes, I've encountered this attitude in feminist studies before.

I'm not sure how it connects to my points though?

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Lady
(@jillannquinn)
Joined: 4 years ago

Noble Member     Reno, Nevada, United States of America
Posts: 627

@veroslondon Labels make up our world. They always have and they always will. And each of us fit into multiple labels whether they’re our own or someone else’s or both. No one is just one thing. Some examples of what many of us, if not all of us, are: Son, father, brother, uncle, nephew, husband and so on. We’re also our jobs or careers. I won’t bother to list any, you get the point.

Like many things, labels can be used for good or bad, to help or to harm. My wife told me that I was a cross dresser when I told her I wanted to wear panties and bras. For whatever the reason, I never considered that label for myself. Instead, I used labels like freak, pervert, weirdo or monster. When she labeled me as a cross dresser I had an “ah ha” moment and suddenly I understood myself better.

Through that understanding, I was able to let go of the shame and negative labels in favor of a new and positive one! To quote Robert Frost, “And that has made all the difference.”

Hugs, Jill

 

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Duchess
(@alison-anderson)
Joined: 6 years ago

Noble Member     Middlesex county, New Jersey, United States of America
Posts: 1742

@veroslondon I agree with the many here who said that we need labels to categorize things in. While I might recognize a few trees in my yard, I can't recognize and distinguish every single tree, or even every species of tree. We modify our definition of tree when we see something different. Some trees have edible fruit, some have different shaped leaves. A birch tree has white bark. A pine tree looks like a tree but has needles instead of leaves. A blue spruce has blue-green needles. Then we get to a bonzai tree, and we know it isn't really a tree but something sculpted to look like a tree. We may or may not expand our defintion.

I think what most people missed here is that labels aren't mutually exclusive. I can be all dolled up ready to go out and my kids will still call me Dad. Also, labels shouldn't be little boxes that confine us. They should be stepping stones for greater conversation. Some people may use the term dual gender, others bi-gender, and still others gender fluid. They're all pretty close, and unless you have a conversation with the individual you may not understand the label.

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Posts: 174
Lady
(@butteryeffect)
Reputable Member     Preston, Lancashire, United Kingdom
Joined: 2 years ago

Categorisation and classification is an essential part of communication without which everything would be just a "thing". The word "label" may be in some circumstances considered pejorative, especially in the sense of a label being applied to a person rather than it being a category with which the individual identifies.

Me calling you "a tranny" might offend you, me calling myself "a tranny" in jest is okay. I identify as bi-gender and I'm happy to be classified or labelled as such, part of which means to the outside world I crossdress, however if part of me is female then it is not crossdressing it is just dressing as the appropriate gender.

See, its complicated ...

 

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Posts: 1078
Managing Ambassador
(@melodeescarlet)
Famed Member     DC/Baltimore, Maryland, United States of America
Joined: 2 years ago

Posted by: @butteryeffect

Categorisation and classification is an essential part of communication without which everything would be just a "thing".

Cathy has hit the point here. Human brains are innate lablers. All things we encounter need a name, a category - something so we can classify it. We have labeled literally every animal we know of (in Latin naturally).

So to me there's no separating our basic human instinct in this or any instance. However, what we can do is try to be more aware in our use of them for those who are in a more sensitive state.

Then again, I'd restate my standard line: Someone's reaction to you says everything about them, and nothing about you. So if someone calls me 'tranny' - be it intentionally mean or not - well that says no more about me than if they'd called me Napoleon. (shrug) Smile and go on about your business. If I let that bother me, then my reaction is what's telling because that's the part I get control over.

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Duchess
(@2bmadeline)
Joined: 2 years ago

Reputable Member     Walla Walla, Washington, United States of America
Posts: 305

@melodeescarlet Beautifully said.

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Posts: 370
Lady
(@sf)
Prominent Member     SoCal, California, United States of America
Joined: 3 years ago

I don't get all wrapped around the axle about labels.  Heck, I label things - my kids alway joked with me about that.  

As for me, I "label" myself a hetero crossdresser, wifey says that I am a crossdresser and rarely a transvestite (I prefer the latter).  

Labels are all around us, for me it ain't no thang, I just do me and try to stay happy.  

Have fun, Staci...

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Duchess
(@missylinda)
Joined: 2 years ago

Noble Member     Ft Worth, Texas, United States of America
Posts: 851

@sf who would not agree with Staci, she is a”reputable member”.  But also consider Melodee’s post, after all she is a “ noble member”.  Be sure to read Cathy,  she is an “estimable  member “.   As for myself, “ persona non grata” 🫣🫢

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Lady
(@butteryeffect)
Joined: 2 years ago

Reputable Member     Preston, Lancashire, United Kingdom
Posts: 174

@missylinda Genuine LoL, well said

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Duchess
(@missylinda)
Joined: 2 years ago

Noble Member     Ft Worth, Texas, United States of America
Posts: 851

@butteryeffect don’t encourage a “ smart aleck”.

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Ambassador
(@lucyb112)
Joined: 2 years ago

Noble Member     Staffordshire, United Kingdom
Posts: 1005

@missylinda brilliant 🙂

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Duchess
(@missylinda)
Joined: 2 years ago

Noble Member     Ft Worth, Texas, United States of America
Posts: 851

@lucyb112  “ brilliant “.  Now  that’s a label  I’ve NEVER had.

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Ambassador
(@lucyb112)
Joined: 2 years ago

Noble Member     Staffordshire, United Kingdom
Posts: 1005

@missylinda 

I don’t believe that at all

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Posts: 1461
(@finallyfiona)
    Leighton Buzzard, Bedfordshire, United Kingdom
Joined: 1 year ago

Having a headline label like 'crossdresser' certainly has its uses.  Without it, how many of us would have found this site? 

Beyond the headline though, labels can be meaningless and therefore fail. Would every member within a labelled group see themselves in the generally accepted or clinical description of that label?  Particularly if it covers a really wide range, can a label be successfully divided into labelled sub-groups?

Ironically given that it's us humans who make the labels, I think that they fail the worst when used to describe people and our behaviours.  It's like we forget that they are all really just subsets of a larger group which, rather than being distinct from each other, can overlap.

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Posts: 23
Duchess
(@jessij)
Trusted Member     New Orleans, Louisiana, United States of America
Joined: 1 year ago

     Personally, I have never been conflicted about my gender. I started dressing in my preteen years and have always wanted to be a girl when I was wearing girl clothes, when I wasn't I was a boy. Looking back now, I can't explain why I have excepted me being both genders without questions but I always have.

     Like Cathy, for years I have considered myself bi-gender.  Because I have never thought of myself as a guy in a dress when I'm Jessi. I see Jessi as the female version of me. I am happier as Jessi but my other gender has its role to play. 

     In my opinion and my opinion only, I think most crossdressers put to much emphasis on trying to be just one gender. If your happy with both versions of yourself then be yourself. 

     I hope every woman here finds peace in who you are and except the inner beauty you all possess!!

 

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Posts: 3446
Hostess
(@ab123)
Illustrious Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Joined: 5 years ago

Labelling was so simple in the early days like you Veronica there wasn't much about so it was simple. As you say, Transvestite and Transgender. I feel the newer term  'Crossdresser' or 'Transgender' is much nicer.

In the last decade 'labelling' has become a huge thing as has 'spectrums' and it doesn't just cover us. I think that the word 'Trans' has become a wide meaning for people to attach a label or indeed invent a label to add to a very long list. It also involves sexuality to add another dimension. Each want to be different and I believe that this does those of us crossdressers or transgendered a disservice, is counterproductive to our needs and publics perception of us.

I can see from some posts that it adds to the confusion we feel about ourselves, 'What am I', 'Who am I' and trying to find a label adds to angst.

In the late sixties there was Flower power and Unisex clothing which raised eyebrows but no body demanded any different rights, it was fashion, a lifestyle that moved on to glam rock and new wave eras, boys wore makeup and looked effeminate, there was androgyny and a bit of gender bending but it was taken as a fashion and it moves on. These were times when the transgender and crossdressers felt more at ease in coming out as attitudes changed and a better understanding and acceptance followed as you were either one or the other.

I may have a contentious view but a lot of it is transient lifestyle or fashion identity where you move on at some point. Somehow labelling seems to infer that the individuals under that label should be afforded 'rights' and privilege which has upset a few groups and individuals hence the review of laws and also previous laws being rescinded or reviewed as the backlash to this. There was so much progress in acceptance and understanding of us which gave us protections that are in danger of disappearing. 

I go back to the simpler days. If you wear womens clothes you are a crossdresser. If you believed you were the opposite sex and wanted to change you are Transgender, sexuality or preferences isn't a consideration. You were one or the other and nothing in between.

It is my personal view and apologise if I offended anyone but sometimes simpler is best.

 

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7 Replies
Baroness
(@river)
Joined: 1 year ago

Noble Member     New Hampshire, United States of America
Posts: 827

@ab123 I Like the glam rock reference  its odd how things go one way for a while and you think we are heading in the right direction.  then  abruptly things take a huge step backwards.  feels like that has happened again recently.  It deeply saddens me. RC

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(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@ab123 Hi Angela, thanks for your thoughtful comments. When I wrote this post I was thinking of a time a few years ago when I joined a "trans" forum which advertised itself as welcoming girls of all trans persuasions. However, when I discovered that nearly all the posts were about issues like Gender Identity Clinics, Gender Recognition Certificates, getting GP referrals for gender dysphoria, and other problems associated with transitioning I realised that this site probably wasn't for me. Better labelling of the site would have steered me away in the first place. 

Also, I'm now leaning towards the idea that most behaviours are on a spectrum. Autism is a classic example of a behaviour with a wide spectrum of those who are mildly affected to those who are severely affected. And doesn't your example of boys in the 1970's willingly embracing androgynous fashions indicate that maybe all males have some (however minor) inclination towards what we love to do? Can fashions take hold without there being some innate "desire" for that fashion? I think most labels just describe the behaviour of the middle of the bell curve and not the extremes at either end. It means labels have their limitations but can still be useful.

Veronica xx

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Hostess
(@ab123)
Joined: 5 years ago

Illustrious Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 3446

@veroslondon Hi Veronica,

I do not have an issue with labelling per se. It does give people comfort and helps to know where they are reflecting lifestyle and the person they are but has it gone too far?

Labeling in a medical sense is to identify a condition to assist treatment. I agree there are spectrums as to severity of such conditions identified thus directing the treatment required.

Trans gender can be interpreted as a singular condition as medical interventions are required and what they are depends on the individual and their requirements. Once diagnosed there was a set pathway of treatment which was accepted and protections in law and regulations provided.

This is why I believe that the labeling and spectrum of this new 'Trans' meaning who have been hankering for protections and rights without interventions has put back those that are at the extreme of the spectrum as resources are being diluted. 

I say this as one who has benefited from the protections and is engaging with my doctor to complete my path to full transition. Maybe I am old fashioned in thinking that a proper approved path is necessary to assess my whole health and that this is worthy of medical intervention. The expected wait was maybe two years and I would expect to be attending the G.R.C. clinic soon but now have a further four year wait which by then I may be too old to complete the process. I also  have had negative experiences of late which after over a decade is worrying.

Due to the demands made by the more vocal there has been a backlash that sees Transgender as a threat to women although pre ''spectrum labeling' it wasn't, so how has this come about? Is it due to capitulation of organisations to the Trans activists demands which led to some unfortunate issues such as in prisons which self identification trans prisoners were housed in womens prisons then assaulted female inmates. This fueled the backlash which makes the public uneasy leading to the possibility that the protections will be withdrawn or revised.  

Whether Trans or out in public crossdresser this labeling obsession has had some detrimental outcomes. 

 

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(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@ab123 Hi Angela

Firstly, can I express my sympathies for all the hassle you are going through with doctors and bureaucrats to just get recognition of what you are. I know sympathy doesn't butter any parsnips but you deserve better than what's available right now. You have rightly recognised the tendency for those at the margins of "spectrums" to divert funds from the genuinely deserving -- self diagnosis seems to play a major part in this area.

I sometimes think it would be nice to go back to the simpler times in the UK before whoever it was stood up in parliament in 2018 and announced that all that would be needed for someone to officially obtain a GRC was self-identification. Before then there was very little debate about trans issues and we went about our business very much under the radar. The general view at the time was that if you presented as a woman then you should be treated as a woman. Now, everyone seems to have an opinion and the overly simplistic concept that a person cannot change their biological sex is slapped down on the table like a trump card. All the nuance and compromise that existed pre-2018 now seems to have disappeared.

Veronica xx

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Hostess
(@ab123)
Joined: 5 years ago

Illustrious Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 3446

@veroslondon Thank you Veronica for me it is what it is and I am able to carry on but have fears, which is the trump card you eluded to as much as issues related to Self Identification. As much as it acknowledged that they 'Respect and understand' transgender the following rhetoric is all but demonic, inferring we are all perverts and will harm women, which for the majority of us is completely untrue and without  reasoned foundation, along with the issue that the variety of gender identification and organisations that have pandered to the woke agenda thus the claim that these policies are trying to 'eradicate' women, has also been placed at at our doors, again without any reasoned foundation. There appears to be no quarter - we must be debarred from all womens areas, although we have a protection at the moment 'within reason' which used sensitively works well, and can continue to work well, but if they get their way reasonableness goes out the window. so much for respect and understanding.

I am worried about daily life, being allowed to live without fear of criminalisation, Harm, discrimination, alienation and suspicion. Thus moving backwards in time.

Perhaps I am looking at a doomsday scenario as life is still okay. I hope that with the current political situation the legislators will have more pressing things to do, this will go on the back burner and by the time everything is over reason may come to the fore. Alternatively it could be slipped through on the quiet as was tried a few years ago.

As you said things were going along quite nicely.

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(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@ab123 Hi again Angela

As an example of never avoiding a passing band-wagon, this morning I saw this headline for an  article in a UK online journal -- "Spanish Soldiers Expose Flaw in Gender Self-Identification. Talk about clutching at straws to justify some column inches!

What I think is odd is that a lot of the critical comment today about trans rights comes from presumably non-trans men. I can sort of accept that some women might be genuinely nervous about the safety consequences of a more liberal attitude towards trans issues but I hardly think this applies to any men at all. So why have male journalists taken up the baton on behalf of cis-women to protect their right to cis-women only spaces mostly quoting conveniently that no-one can change their biological sex? Personally, I think it's just a convenient reason to adopt some moral high ground for what is no more than good old fashioned prejudice. As you say, these comments may be prefaced with some weasel words about dignity and understanding but are not really supported by any hard evidence. The fact that a man can't change his biological sex is hardly justification for completely ignoring all the complex nuances around what it means to be a trans woman in the UK right now. Even a minimal amount of dignity and understanding would recognise the necessity to address these nuances and not listen only to the demands of some feminist activists.

With luck, all the current hoo hah about trans right will, as you hope, die down and after a convenient interval will be forgotten. Unfortunately this may not be in my lifetime.

Veronica

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Lady
(@jillleanne)
Joined: 2 years ago

Prominent Member     Renfrew, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 605

@ab123 I really did not want to participate in this but something just won’t let it go. lol  I love your post really. We differ so slightly in thoughts on this. I once had no idea at age five, who I was. Then  someone said I was a fetishist, then a cd. Ok. Then Someone invented computers. Then I was a transvestite, then a she male, then Somehow, I was a member of the 2slgbtzcnjuggceewadhnkk1 community. Somewhere along the way, I decided our community was in a state of chaos. How do we advance our acceptance in society if we do not or cannot agree who we are? How can we expect others to accept us if we can’t agree on who we are? I adopted the term transgender as an umbrella term to identify as. If you need to know more, ask. But I only identify as transgender and I only identify everyone else in the spectrum as trans also. It makes things simple, easy, non threatening, and understandable to the masses. All the rest of the world needs to accept is we are different than just male or female. Nothing more. If society as a whole really knew how many people identify as crossdresser s for example, the jaw dropping would cause a flood. But that won’t happen because acceptance does not exist today. Why? Because we have so many labels and people living in the closet that others cannot understand or accept there are more than just males and females. Yes, bi and gay have certainly gained the most ground because they are easily identifiable through efforts by themselves. Be we need closets to hide in until acceptance arrives, if ever.

   Until that day arrives, I’m transgender. 

my I hate this topic.  Lol

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Posts: 1805
Baroness Annual
(@d44)
Famed Member     New York, United States of America
Joined: 5 years ago

I think that labels are sometimes necessary as a way of helping our brains organize things.

My label = A non-transitioning transgender woman living full time as a female.

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Posts: 55
Lady
(@sallyj)
Estimable Member     California, United States of America
Joined: 1 year ago

Whoa, another conceptually difficult topic! (I’m new not only to this site but any social media site, so I’m not sure what I expected, and I feel way out of my element.)

Having said that, I recognize that labels serve a useful purpose, as descriptive and for categorization. But then comes the difficulties — what are the labels used for, how are they defined, who gets to define them, when do they shift from descriptive to pejorative, and what happens if you inadvertently “misuse” them.

And adding a social science aspect to it strikes me as making it even more complicated, which may be why I’m content to be a “crossdresser” but I don’t think I want to be an “autogynephiliac” (assuming that’s the right label).

Many decades ago, I took a college course in “abnormal” psychology, where we (ignorantly) referred to those who deviated from the “norm” as “deviants.” I hope those labels are history now, especially when I think fondly of friends and colleagues who most of us would now consider to be “normal” but would have then been otherwise labeled by the textbook, as I guess so would I.

Maybe I’ll have a nightcap. Cheers!

 

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Posts: 263
Lady
Topic starter
(@veroslondon)
Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Joined: 1 year ago

Sally, I think all I was trying to say is that sometimes labels can help us to firstly realise there other people out there who share some of our "behaviours" (for want of a better word) and then home in on those who we can best discuss those behaviours with. For example, how could I have found CDH without knowing I was a cross-dresser

But I agree, labels used as an insult are not helpful.

Veronica xx

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1 Reply
Lady
(@sallyj)
Joined: 1 year ago

Estimable Member     California, United States of America
Posts: 55

@veroslondon Thanks for the explanation, Veronica. And I fully accept your point that labels are necessary and can be helpful. I was just exploring the flip side of them.

By the way, I’ve enjoyed the discussions in both of your recent topics. Very mentally stimulating.

Sally

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Posts: 2172
 J J
Lady
(@jjandme)
Famed Member     California, United States of America
Joined: 5 years ago

People like to categorize things. It just makes things simpler, but there are rarely clear demarcations between categories with a lot of overlap or fuzzy boundaries. Labels are helpful, but should not be relied on too heavily.

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1 Reply
(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@jjandme Hi JJ

I think most labels are designed to apply to the middle of the bell curve and not the extremes but it doesn't mean they don't have any use.

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Posts: 747
(@christineth)
Noble Member     Brussels, Brabant, Belgium
Joined: 2 years ago

Personally I am very ok with being labelled as a crossdresser or a transvestite or tranny or indeed any of the other numerous terms that are used to describe crossdressing.  I know the terms are often used in a derogatory and hurtful way, but being a crossdresser is only one part of me.  A part that I am very happy to be.  I am of course not only a crossdresser, but many other things, a husband (wife?), a father (mother?), a scientist, a table tennis player, a history lover, an artist and so many other things.  As indeed we all are, we are complex people made up of many things.  For me labels are only bad when that one thing is seen as the only thing that you are.

I am sorry if others see these terms as negative, insulting, hurtful words (I hope I am not being naive about such labels) and I do think that everyone should be allowed to use the terms or not for themselves.  But for me, as Frankenfurter said: “I’m just a sweet transvestite from Transsexual, Transylvania.” and I’m rather happy and proud to be so.

So come on ladies, lets claim the labels back and stop the negative connotations the public at large may ascribe to them; for me these terms describe an inspiring and usually happy way of life that hurts no one, but brings peace and tranquillity to those of use who are what those labels summarily describe.

Hugs

Christine

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Posts: 58
Lady
(@kimmes)
Estimable Member     Noord-Holland, Netherlands
Joined: 1 year ago

I think labels are a necessary evil. It gives the animal a name (as we say in The Netherlands), but it also creates stigma. The most exaggerated examples often create the image people have of something. By the way, the Dutch word for 'transvestite' is 'travestiet', which is more similar to the English word 'travesty'. Plus, the 'tiet' in the word unintentionally has the meaning 'tit'.  😆
'Crossdresser' sounds good to me; I see myself as a man who once in a while wears clothes that are seen as feminine.  But even more, I just would like to be seen as an androgynous dresser.

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Posts: 935
Guest
(@Anonymous 47410)
Prominent Member
Joined: 6 years ago

I started dressing as a girl in the 1950s, around five years of age, and thankfully, labels have caused me only minor issues.

Christine Jorgensen was a big media story in the 1950s and into the 60s, and the media labeled her with several different transgender terms.  This caused some confusion with my crossdressing in that for a time I began to question my own status, as far transitioning. 

In college in the 1960s, with access to a university library for research, I learned that I was a transvestite, a label I never heard of. 

By the 1970s, the media was now fascinated with the story of Renee Richards and again tossing around all types of transgender terminology labels.  They were doing this label tossing just at a time when I was trying to explain to my future wife what the difference was between a CD and a transgendered person. 

Sadly, the media gave no publicity to Virginia Prince and Carol Beecroft, who in 1976 formed TriEss, the national organization for crossdressers.  That would have made my job easier explaining to my future wife who crossdressers are.  Remember, there was no internet back then in the 1970s. 

My point?  Labels?  They can be a nuisance, but necessary at times. 

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2 Replies
(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@catgurl Hi Peggy Sue

Your story sounds very similar to mine. We obviously grew up about the same time although on opposite sides of the Atlantic. In the 1960's, the trans focus was on those who had undergone a sex-change and there was very little discussion about transvestism so for those like you and me what we thought might lie ahead for us was very confusing! Like you, discovering the word transvestite and what it meant was quite a relief.

Veronica xx

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Guest
(@Anonymous 47410)
Joined: 6 years ago

Prominent Member
Posts: 935

@veroslondon 

Indeed, although I knew where I fit in and maybe even what "label" fit me, I knew I still faced much uncertainty back in the 70s, as I am sure many CDs felt the same way. 

Amazing though, fast forward to 2024, and here we are in a welcoming world where IMHO labels are disappearing.  For example, I go in a store now, and no one cares what I am, my money spends the same as anyone else, and other customers are too busy to stare at me.

Here in the deep south USA in Atlanta, Georgia in August we are preparing to host the Atlanta Comfort Conference, a huge event which will bring in national and internationally recognized speakers.  Hopefully, many CDH girls will attend. 

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Posts: 210
Lady
(@denises924)
Reputable Member     Massachusetts, United States of America
Joined: 1 year ago

Labels helped me to determine where I am on this spectrum. Over the years I have determined that I am not transgendered, TG or trans. Nor I do fall under any dysphoria terms or multiple genders. A few years ago, it became clear to me that I am a crossdresser. I enjoy wearing the clothes of the opposite sex because of the way it makes me feel. Until that point, I was constantly trying to determine what applied to me. I understand that other folks use these terms, but personally I don't care for Transvestite, tranny or gurl for my situation. I am a crossdresser or CD and I am good with that.

I hope that adds something to this interesting topic.
Thanks for listening.

Denise
😊  

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2 Replies
(@veroslondon)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 263

@denises924 Hi Denise

 

I think all I'm trying to say is that labels can help us to understand where we are in the big trans mix and seek out the like minded for help and support.

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Lady
(@denises924)
Joined: 1 year ago

Reputable Member     Massachusetts, United States of America
Posts: 210

@veroslondon 

Hi Veronica
I agree, as labels definitely helped me define myself. And I definitely feel folks should use whatever labels they are comfortable with. I was just mentioning my thoughts.

Thanks again for bringing up this thoughtful topic.

Denise
❤️

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