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Constrained by maleness

35 Posts
19 Users
114 Reactions
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Posts: 933
Lady
Topic starter
(@maureen76)
Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Joined: 6 months ago

I know things are changing now, but growing up in the 50's and 60's there were many constraints places upon males. You couldn't cry, show fear, get emotional, or walk away from a fight without being teased mercilessly about it. The clothes you could wear, or the hairstyle you could have were limited or you would be called names. You were expected to be assertive, aggressive, outgoing, and successful in life. When here, expressing my soft feminine side I feel much more emotive, expressive and sense all those old male expectations melting away. I am guessing many of us feel that way? Hugs Maureen

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8 Replies
Lady
(@tia)
Joined: 8 months ago

Reputable Member     Shady Cove, Oregon, United States of America
Posts: 139

@maureen76 Oh yes, the 50s and 60s were very narrow minded, but I knew who I was and what was expected of me. The 70s came along and everything flipped over, and I didn't know what was happening or where I belonged. It took me most of the decade to get some semblance of order back into my life. I was always sort of awkward trying to fit into the macho crowd, so I spent a lot of time with myself through high school. I had always been fascinated by women's clothing but never did anything about it until the last few years. When I found CDH I started getting more confident about who I am and where I belong in the world, namely wherever I want to be.

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Lady
(@leslienix)
Joined: 6 months ago

Reputable Member     Southport, Merseyside, United Kingdom
Posts: 169

@maureen76 "I know things are changing now"

When non-conforming identities were considered a medical disease, psychiatrists used medical treatments, such as electroconvulsive shock, lobotomy, drugs, and psychoanalysis to cure or prevent "deviancy." Psychologists in the 1960s and 1970s described being LGBTQ+ as an attachment disorder—that people were attached to inappropriate erotic or sexual desires. They believed that using aversions (such as electrical shock stimuli) could modify behavior and lead to heterosexuality and "cure." It did not work.(source: americanhistory.si.edu)

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Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@leslienix yes very sad times----I think the book "One Flew Over the Cuckoos Nest" by Kesey helped change some of that----Hugs, Maureen

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Duchess
(@flatlander48)
Joined: 5 years ago

Noble Member     Cathedral City, California, United States of America
Posts: 1467

@maureen76 For the most part, I don’t think that has happened for me. I came out as transgender about 10 years ago. One of my revelations was that even though I did nothing regarding presentation before that, my thinking was always in 2 worlds. However, it took a LONG time to realize that.

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Duchess Annual
(@emmat)
Joined: 9 months ago

Honorable Member     I don't do cities ;-), Powys, United Kingdom
Posts: 266

@maureen76 

I'm going to take a more optimistic view of the 60s (certainly not the 50s) . Sorry if im getting carried away.

I do remember growing up in the 50s in a 'grim up north' mining town. But the 60s , just WOW .  As a whole, it was such an exciting time to be in and I'm sorry to those who never got to experience any of the positives.

The 60s were a musical monster.The Beatles appeared, matched by the Stones at every turn.  And Motown and Stax knocking out Soul  music to die for. They introduced sometimes irreverence, sometimes thoughtfulness  and uplifted the youth of the nation.

JFK, civil rights movements, Vietnam protests, anti apartheid movements, magical space missions. Workers on a pittance no longer grateful when rich employers said 'At least you've got a job'. 

Suddenly you felt like a bit actor in a movie who could shout out "I don't like the part I'm playing!". 

The beat movement, to be followed by the hippies and psychedelia. And, at least in cities, a growing 'im gay so what?' movement.  And so many brave souls who didn't just stand up and be counted, they led the way, and more than a few times suffered for their actions, and in doing so energised the next wave of brave souls.

While conceding the multitude of societal and political problems, and prejudice - and admitting to some of the bad options some folk took - the 60s shaped me and i feel so lucky to have had my formative years in that decade.

Anyway, I must go, so that's the end of the propaganda screed. I'm off to the Green Man festival and help indoctrinate my 3 yo granddaughter into enjoying life. Who's got the glitter?

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Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@emmat I agree---In the 60's --"The Times They Are A Changing" as Bob Dylan said----It was an incredible time to be alive---with so much new and incredible music to listen to and new ideas to ponder. New social movements to consider and change, change, change everywhere. This is where attitudes towards gender roles first started to change----Maureen

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Baroness
(@annaredhead)
Joined: 10 months ago

Famed Member     Cornwall, United Kingdom
Posts: 1658

@maureen76 Yes! I was born in the 70s with many of the same expectations, grew up playing football and rugby, went to an all-male school, had a career in a pretty macho environment.

Hugs,

Anna x

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(@lauren114)
Joined: 1 year ago

Noble Member     Delaware, United States of America
Posts: 1161

@maureen76 Expressing my feelings openly is still something I am working on.   I was taught to be bottled up and unfortunately I'm still that way for the most part.   I hope  that one day when I can start HRT this will be one of the changes I experience.

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Posts: 596
(@heels234)
Prominent Member     Mesa, Arizona, United States of America
Joined: 9 years ago

Yes ,growing up in the 50s and 60s was very hard .We ,as males were expected to be tough and not show any emotion at all.I went to a Catholic boys only high school and my gym coach for all four years was a retired Marine Drill Instructor with 30 years in the Corps.I smiled all thru the last gym class and walked past the coach with the biggest smile he had ever seen and I never said a word to him.I DO NOT MISS HIM  or the other stuff we as males were expected to do.Thats why I am very comfortable on this site allowing my softer side to shine thru.

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9 Replies
(@lisanicole)
Joined: 6 years ago

Estimable Member     Scottsdale, Arizona, United States of America
Posts: 74

I also was forced to go to a Catholic all boys high school in the late 60's. Jacket and tie all 4 years. I cringe at all the wasted hours of my life sitting in religion and Latin classes. Trying to learn Spanish memorizing from a book. (Hola Isabel...como esta) There was absolutely no alternative thinking allowed. YOU STAY IN YOUR BOX! The door didn't hit me in the ass when I left. Being involved in the public school systems for 22 years, I was glad to see students able to express themselves more freely through the years. I was so jealous that I couldn't at their ages. However, the conservative/hate people will never stop. (Ten commandments in classrooms) There is still a long road ahead.

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Lady
(@michellebb)
Joined: 2 years ago

Estimable Member     Paradise Valley, Arizona, United States of America
Posts: 100

@lisanicole your stereotype conservative people not true

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Guest
(@Anonymous 93795)
Joined: 1 year ago

Estimable Member
Posts: 189
  • @michellebb I am with you. Conservative does not equal hate.
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Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@chanel True that---I am conservative and not a hater nor are most of the conservatives I know ---

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(@lisanicole)
Joined: 6 years ago

Estimable Member     Scottsdale, Arizona, United States of America
Posts: 74

Please forgive me. I did not mean conservative equals hate.

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Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@lisanicole Thanks Lisa---appreciate it---Hugs Maureen

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Guest
(@Anonymous 93795)
Joined: 1 year ago

Estimable Member
Posts: 189

@lisanicole Thank you Lisa- I enjoy your contributions!

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Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@heels234 Hi Tia, I live by San Francisco and when the 70's came along there was already a great deal of change going on especially in the hippie movement that I was part of---young people were moving away from the stereotypes that had bound us during the 50's and 60's---it was a liberating times and opened the door to many of the gender role changes in attitude we see today---Hugs Maureen

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Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@heels234 Hi Michelle---I feel the same way---here I do not have to live withing those constraints --Hugs Maureen

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Posts: 23
Lady
(@karynrivers)
Trusted Member     Illinois, United States of America
Joined: 6 months ago

I grew up in the 60's and 70's. Yes, there were many challenges at home, school, society. I thought my secret would be buried forever. I am glad that I can accept and express myself, but we still have a long way to go.

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1 Reply
Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@karynrivers Yes we do Karyn----but at least we are starting ---Hugs Maureen

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Posts: 2022
Hostess
(@cdsue)
Famed Member     Delaware, United States of America
Joined: 5 years ago

Ain't that the truth sister.

I also grew up in the 50's - 60's and all the turmoil of that era. As a male there was no crying, doing boy things (playing with trucks, playing cowboys and Indians, soldier, baseball, etc) was what was expected. A regular haircut for school and a crewcut for the summer was what was expected. In my household don't even think about growing long hair (the hippie era) as it was part of the counter culture (read drugs, rock and roll music, "wierd" clothes). I had 3 younger sisters and when we were home due to a snow day and couldn't go out of the house I would play with them - Barbies, tea party, trying make up (mostly lipstick), walking in heels, etc.. It was during that time that I started trying on my mother's clothes and it felt good wearing them. I suppressed those feelings throughout my life. There were occasions in between marriages that I would try on some lingerie that was left behind but that was it. It was about 5 years ago that my dressing finally exposed itself which is a story in and of itself. Since that time I have embraced my dressing. I have come to accept my feminine side with the help of my therapist and my loving wife. At first she felt betrayed but after many conversations she has come to accept my dressing. She helps me in many ways and has become comfortable enough with Suzanne to allow her to visit on occasion. I often think how different life would have been if I had been able to express my true self but realize I can't go back and just need to enjoy what I have moving forward. 

XOX 

Suzanne

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1 Reply
Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@cdsue Hi Suzanne---that is a very touching story---the important part is that you finally got to where you are at today with a wife and therapist that are helping yo move forward with your feminine identity---I like your last words ===" I can't go back and just need to enjoy what I have moving forward."

You go girl! Hugs Maureen

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Posts: 2079
 J J
Lady
(@jjandme)
Famed Member     California, United States of America
Joined: 5 years ago

I was born in rhe late 50s, so consider myself a child of the 60s and 70s, which was actually a pretty sweet spot. I had the 60s crew cut, wore only Levi jeans for play and slacks and button down shorts to school. Then the counter culture hit, I grew shoulder length hair and not being "establishment" was the thing. Most importantly, it was a time of questioning the status quo, and accepting "others". I had a great college course on human sexuality and we discussed alternate lifestyles and had LGBT speaks and learned they are normal people who just happen to do things differently the "typical" people.

So, my early "training" was to repress all those urges, questions, wonderings, but soon was urge to do just the opposite. In hindsight, I did repress many of those feminine traits that we were suppose to not have, but soon learned to accept them in others, even if I did still supress them in myself. Now, after having dressed for some time, and allowing those feeling to come out, which just seemed easier to allow when dressed, I have found a much better balance in my life.

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1 Reply
Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@jjandme I also find it is easier to allow the softer, gentler, more emotional side of me out when dressed or on this site---Hugs Maureen

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Posts: 326
Lady
(@splitdecision)
Honorable Member     Doylestown, Pennsylvania, United States of America
Joined: 4 years ago

I was born in the late 50’s and grew up in the 60’s and early 70’s  because of the lack of available information I had little idea of what was going on with me. Outwardly I was all boy, but inward I enjoyed feeling girly and at times wished I was a girl. Somehow through society I knew what I was doing and feeling was pretty much unacceptable. And if it ever came out I would be teased and harassed mercilessly. Sissy and girly boy come to mind. I still don’t understand how I made it through those years. I knew it wasn’t accepted but I also knew it’s who I was. 
I hope it’s better for today’s youth. I know there’s more information and help available but also a large stigma and hate out there. 

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1 Reply
Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@splitdecision I think it is much better for today's youth---the pendulum has swung full circle so to say

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Posts: 1188
(@rebeccabaxter)
    Cornwall, United Kingdom
Joined: 1 year ago

Speaking only of the UK: I would not like to be a youth today. Social media pressures and bullying, gangs, carrying knives, synthetic drugs, vapes, violence. The youth of today have no fear of retribution as the police will do nothing, the parents can do nothing, even if they wanted to, and so many don't care themselves. Out of touch governments, over-stretched services, etc. etc.

I was born in 1954 and while I lived through the sixties, I didn't really care for them, I just played football or messed about with my mates. The seventies however, was a different matter, especially the music -- progressive rock, Yes, Hawkwind, Pink Floyd -- that WAS fun (in some cases it still is, although most of them are in their seventies or eighties).

The 1970s fashion?! Ah, now there was a social faux pas on a grand scale -- stacked heels, Ben Sherman shirts, flared velvet suits; doesn't bear thinking about.

Don't get me wrong, I like modern technology and up-to-date things -- this forum, for example, wouldn't exist without it. I like my modern mobile phone, my motorbike that doesn't leak oil and break down every ten minutes, my car that mostly doesn't rust. I like modern days because I have lived though one of the best and safest periods in human history, I just wouldn't want to live now as a teenager. I am now in my seventies and whatever bad is happening, or is going to happen soon in the world, it's really not going to bother me for too long.

These days, I'm just an old transvestite with no more axes to grind. I like to dress and sit in the sun, watching the world go by.

Dreamy

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4 Replies
Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@rebeccabaxter Hi Becca----good points about the youth of today and what they face that we didn't have to face---one of the few good things is that there is less concern over rigid gender roles, but perhaps that doesn't come close to making up for all the negatives you mentioned.

I love the way you ended your message---it gave me a laugh =="These days, I'm just an old transvestite with no more axes to grind. I like to dress and sit in the sun, watching the world go by." I feel the same--- Hugs Maureen

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Lady
(@sallybchester)
Joined: 5 months ago

Estimable Member     Wrexham, Clwyd, United Kingdom
Posts: 45

Posted by: @rebeccabaxter

progressive rock, Yes, Hawkwind, Pink Floyd -- that WAS fun .

my first proper concert was seeing Hawkwind in Liverpool Stadium in 1971 - That blew my mind - the music, the visuals. the characters, Stacia topless dancing 200 yards away was very erotic for a spotty 14 year old haha loved it. 

 

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(@lauren114)
Joined: 1 year ago

Noble Member     Delaware, United States of America
Posts: 1161

@sallybchester I saw Hawkwind in the Bottom Line in NYC in the late 1970's.  Not the same experience as Liverpool Stadium I'm sure but I still loved it.   I sat in the front row and got a contact high from one of their joints....LoL.   I still love Space Ritual alive!   It's also fun to mess with Motorhead fans over here in the US who have no idea of Lemmy's story.

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Lady
(@sallybchester)
Joined: 5 months ago

Estimable Member     Wrexham, Clwyd, United Kingdom
Posts: 45

@lauren114 I love space ritual too - brilliant

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Posts: 1729
Duchess
(@alison-anderson)
Noble Member     Middlesex county, New Jersey, United States of America
Joined: 6 years ago

I'm another one born in the late 50's so grew up in the 60's and 70's. But I don't think I was ever tough or macho. I was more of the intellectual type. Not good at sports (and asthma didn't help), but always did well in school.

While not super long, I did start wearing my hair longer. Not for being a hippie, not for style. I have a very oily face (even today), and I discoverd that my acne always got worse the first few weeks after a hair cut. I reasoned that when the hair was longer, it would absorb some of the oils so my acne was better, and when it was cut the oils would be on my face and make the acne worse. So I would let the hair grow down to my shoulders, and cut it back to the nape of my neck. My father would complain (out of earshot) to my mother, but never to me. My mom was more tolerant of my longer hair. But I was not doing it for rebellion but to keep my acne under control.

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Posts: 1214
Duchess
(@reallylauren)
Noble Member     Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
Joined: 3 years ago

I now know that I was born intersex, and I always had the knowledge that I was supposed to be a girl. But I was also born into constant conflict between my parents. My mother knew I was feminine and nurtured me accordingly. My father was never happy about that, insisting on male activities and expected proper results. Insisting that I be involved in every single high school sport, which I was never good at, threatening to send me to a military school to "man me up" and always trying to line me up with very masculine jobs. I was a disappointment and failed miserably meeting his expectations, and was bullied quite frequently at school because of being feminine and not a fighter.

My mother was a teacher and understood my feminine nature, and my artistic leanings. She taught me music, the various ways of painting pictures, flower arrangement, origami, pottery and we sang in a lot of community choirs.  She knew of my being attracted to femininity, and was aware I was trying on some of her clothing. Her only words to me were, "Don't ever let you father find out!"

I was fortunate that my school years were during the mid 60's to early 70's. The Vietnam decade. I was part of 'The Woodstock Generation', involved in protest marches, my hair was shoulder length, I wore patched blue jeans and tie dyed shirts. In school everyone thought I was gay because I was feminine. All my friends were girls and at that time it was cool to be able to express your emotions, so my femininity became obvious to most people.

In many ways, I never really had to "come out" as many of the people I knew were already aware that I was feminine. Keep in mind there was no terminology at that time other than 'transexual', you were just effeminate or a transvestite. 

Much later on, when I did "come out" at my workplace, as being transgender, nobody was surprised. Many of the women I work with simply said, "We always knew you were just 'one of the girls'"

hugs,

Ms. Lauren M

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1 Reply
Lady
(@maureen76)
Joined: 6 months ago

Noble Member     Bay Area, California, United States of America
Posts: 933

@reallylauren That is a very sweet story Lauren--- you always were one of the girls!

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