- November 20, 2020 at 4:07 pm #408878Lexie TraskParticipantRegistered On: August 9, 2020Topics: 6Replies: 59Has thanked: 74 timesBeen thanked: 298 times
My wife and I had a very bad fight last night, where she called my cross dressing deviant behavior.
there are other things wrong in our marriage, which mostly has to do with me.
- November 22, 2020 at 1:18 pm #409510Rachel WilliamsParticipantRegistered On: June 16, 2019Topics: 2Replies: 174Has thanked: 416 timesBeen thanked: 445 times
Lexie, we want you to get that word “deviant” out of your head. That you are not, sweetie. You are beautiful and caring & don’t let anyone tell you different.
- November 22, 2020 at 1:02 pm #409504Regine RichParticipantRegistered On: October 9, 2020Topics: 11Replies: 179Has thanked: 1764 timesBeen thanked: 625 times
I am truly sorry, Lexi, my heart just breaks each and every time I read a post like yours.
We are all here for you, darling, sisters to the end
- November 22, 2020 at 12:21 pm #409482Lily-Rose NielsenParticipantRegistered On: November 2, 2020Topics: 3Replies: 28Has thanked: 72 timesBeen thanked: 100 times
My ex wife called me far worse things than deviant when she found out, and she is a nurse with sex counseling as speciality. LOL
1 user thanked author for this post.
- November 22, 2020 at 9:11 am #409394Lee Ann RakersParticipantRegistered On: August 18, 2019Topics: 4Replies: 458Has thanked: 715 timesBeen thanked: 1402 times
So sorry Lexie.
- November 22, 2020 at 7:48 am #409370rebekka mooreParticipantRegistered On: January 7, 2017Topics: 77Replies: 846Has thanked: 406 timesBeen thanked: 1616 times
Very sorry, Lexie.
Deviant you are not. This is not so much a choice we make, but something we are driven to do. Part of our genetic makeup.
I fear my wife feels the same, which is why she rejects me where any intimacy is concerned. We cannot change what they truly think or believe. In my case I have to make a (hard) choice. Continue to dress (in the manor I do) and give up all intimacy in our relationship, or stop the dressing and purge everything I have, and be a “man”. I am not currently seen as a “man” in my wife’s eyes.
That hurts. You have to do what’s right for you, and that may involve succumbing to “societies” idea of being a “man”.
Love, hugs and all the best to you.
- November 22, 2020 at 7:26 am #409362Rei DurdenParticipantRegistered On: October 11, 2020Topics: 14Replies: 451Has thanked: 2814 timesBeen thanked: 1678 times
Lexie, I am so sorry that things are unsettled right now.
I won’t be the voice of doom here, a traditional marriage is made of 2 people and it takes both to make it a success or a failure. I always think of any communication as a positive sign, even the loud painful discussions. Silence however is cause for concern.
You are not ‘deviant’ whatsoever, that’s been addressed here already backwards and forwards.
I am really hoping this is just a bump in the road for you and your spouse, that you’ll look back on this time period as a challenge that was met and overcome, strengthening you both mentally and spiritually!
Best wishes, Rei
- November 22, 2020 at 6:38 am #409352patty williamsParticipantRegistered On: January 19, 2019Topics: 62Replies: 1146Has thanked: 1774 timesBeen thanked: 3728 times
I just wanted to weigh in on your experience and give you some support.
You are not a deviant sweetie, those sounds like words of anger because you do not conform to the norm.
I am sorry you are having these marital issues.
My marriage too has been strained severely by my propensity to being feminine.
However we have to be true to who we are.
We think you are normal and beautiful so dont give up on yourself.
Maybe one day she will see this
- November 21, 2020 at 12:36 pm #409147Robyn DevineParticipantRegistered On: October 24, 2020Topics: 9Replies: 274Has thanked: 660 timesBeen thanked: 1044 times
First off – deviant you are NOT!! Try and wash that from your thoughts, I know thats tough to do.
I can speak from a very similar experience with my ex-wife.
Whoever the person your committed to, in your case your wife, starts taking your vulnerabilities like cross dressing and turns them into a weapon to stab and hurt you…mmmm…its not a good sign to say the least.
My EX-wife did it to me. At that moment, our relationship was over because by weaponizing my dressing, she intentionally hurt me. Also by doing that, she betrayed my trust. Once trust is broken like that, its very hard to come back from.
Good luck to you, stand tall and strong
xo – Robyn
- November 21, 2020 at 12:14 pm #409143Bettylou CoxParticipantRegistered On: May 26, 2019Topics: 17Replies: 1494Has thanked: 2514 timesBeen thanked: 4607 times
Some folks are quick to label any act which is atypical or “outside the box” as deviant; but it usually has a sexual connotation, as in gay or S&M. We are Different, absolutely, but deviant? NO. That was a deliberate insult, and I suspect it signals the end of your relationship.
- November 21, 2020 at 8:53 am #409074Bobbi SueParticipantRegistered On: September 15, 2020Topics: 12Replies: 90Has thanked: 120 timesBeen thanked: 536 times
Deviant… That’s simply ex-wife talk. It’s used to cast you, not her, as the marital problem. Keep in mind if you do get divorced, court won’t care that you dress.
And don’t be so quick to blame yourself. I don’t know enough to absolve you of being part of the problem, but I guarantee it’s not all on you.
- November 21, 2020 at 8:34 am #409068Lexie TraskParticipantRegistered On: August 9, 2020Topics: 6Replies: 59Has thanked: 74 timesBeen thanked: 298 times
- November 21, 2020 at 5:38 am #409035Linda Rose NygaardParticipantRegistered On: April 30, 2020Topics: 16Replies: 105Has thanked: 487 timesBeen thanked: 600 times
- November 21, 2020 at 7:16 am #409051Sally DrinkwaterParticipantRegistered On: July 15, 2019Topics: 15Replies: 227Has thanked: 47 timesBeen thanked: 760 times
Devient behaviour is not soley confined to kinky sex, wearing odd socks could be considered deviating from the norm.
Reading the ideas and thoughts of some CDH members is definately abnormal but dressing as a woman is not one of them.
- November 21, 2020 at 1:57 am #408998Grace ScarlettParticipantRegistered On: July 26, 2020Topics: 20Replies: 564Has thanked: 3213 timesBeen thanked: 2895 times
I am sorry your marriage is struggling….the fact you do have cdh as a place to confide and get advice is not just wonderful for you, but I’m sure it makes everyone here feel good too, that we can try to help you through!!…..
What really does stand out for me in your post, is your place of work….wow, it must be a joy to go there each day…it’s amazing how a company can support its workers so well, and make your job a safe place to be…..yet when you leave each day, you enter a world that CAN be so different towards you…and us!!!
Keep positive Lexie, grace ❤️
- November 21, 2020 at 1:35 am #408997Sa•man•thaFounderRegistered On: January 21, 2018Topics: 304Replies: 1442Has thanked: 6279 timesBeen thanked: 5109 times
- November 22, 2020 at 6:28 am #409348
- November 21, 2020 at 12:59 am #408994Laura LovettParticipantRegistered On: March 26, 2020Topics: 8Replies: 412Has thanked: 1151 timesBeen thanked: 1969 times
Deviant suggests that there is a predefined template for human beings that we must all adhere to or be outcast.
To quote Graham Chapman in Monty Python’s “Life of Brian”, You’re all individuals, you’ve all got to think for yourselves – you’re all different!”
We’re all deviants, et viva la difference!
- November 20, 2020 at 9:08 pm #408955Lexie TraskParticipantRegistered On: August 9, 2020Topics: 6Replies: 59Has thanked: 74 timesBeen thanked: 298 times
Hopefully just words in the heart of the moment , not truly felt 😟😟
Unfortunately, that is not the case in my situation. When I told my wife that I am a cross dresser, she didn’t really know what to say. We did have a rather heated argument, since at that time her and I were having many other issues. Although there were a couple of things that did get resolved that day, me being a CD, and som other serious issues between us are still there.
Sometimes I feel more like a secondary support, rather than an equal in a marriage. Monday 11/23/2020, I have an appointment with a therapist.
Around October of 2019, I came out at work as a cross dresser. The HR person that I was working with at the time, unbeknownst to me, had reached out to the corporate Director of EEO and Diversity. Well, the HR person and Pamela (the Director), had a phone discussion. Pamela was SO supportive and said that the company stands behind me. They are VERY involved in the LGBTQ community, and ask some very direct questions. Pamela actually flew out to our campus to give a presentation about me, but also that I am to be treated with respect and dignity. The company does not tolerate any type of derogatory behavior towards ANYONE, regardless of race, creed, religion or sexual identification! When I finally actually met Pamela in person, she was AWESOME! She brought along a therapist to introduce to me, and to be present during the presentation to answer ANY questions the people attending the presentation asked!
after the presentation, which I was not allowed to attend, Pamela and I had to go the the bathroom. I was heading to the single occupancy bathroom, when Pamela said “where are you going?” She grab my hand and marched me right into the women’s bathroom!
well, Pamela and I have become good friends. But, my wife doesn’t see things this openly. I can somewhat see things from her perspective, but I do not 100% agree with her on the topic of cross dressing.
I apologize for rambling, but with this pandemic, I don’t have anyone close to me that I can openly talk to! This community is so fantastic!
Love to All,
- November 21, 2020 at 8:31 am #409065DeeAnn HopingsParticipantRegistered On: November 10, 2019Topics: 11Replies: 671Has thanked: 9 timesBeen thanked: 1649 times
There are some therapists that are working online through Telehealth and other platforms. There may be someone in your area doing this…
- November 20, 2020 at 8:28 pm #408950
- November 20, 2020 at 8:20 pm #408948Araminta PurdyParticipantRegistered On: January 23, 2020Topics: 1Replies: 179Has thanked: 220 timesBeen thanked: 544 times
In case nobody has noticed, I find much of commonly-used terminology questionable as to meaning and usage. The word, deviant, has two, rather dismal, meanings.
First, it implies that something is immoral. The difficulty with the concept of morality is that it is too often based on unverifiable beliefs. To me it is improper to legislate laws or create conventions to be enforced through enforcement, social pressure or ideals of behaviour based on something that cannot be determined to inaccurate or accurate. (So-called ‘masquerade’ laws were used to punish cross-dressers and were condone by a society deeply in the thrall of the ‘pansy’ scare.) Rules such as these should be based on objective reality and not on subjective reality. The right to deviate from social conventions should sometimes be thought of in terms of freedom of expression.
This does not mean that I do not believe in the value of laws, conventions, rules, etc. Especially if they serve an obviously useful purpose even if only in terms of simple courtesy. They not only aid in promoting generally safety but in ameliorating social interactions by providing a common basis for understanding, expectations and communication. They make us comfortable because we know what to expect of others and what is expected of us. They are a communicative lubricant for the potential frictions between individuals and groups.
Cross-dressing creates problems for some people because they do not understand the motivations, they do not know how to respond, they do not know what is expected of them and it lies outside of what they believe to be moral behaviour. As for those things they do not know, the solution is education and the establishment of social conventions that allow each of us to interact without feeling or creating discomfort. People do not like to feel foolish, awkward or at a loss.
For example, how do you refer to a male presenting as a woman? I believe that the convention should be that you use feminine terminology for a feminine presentation and if there is doubt, ask. Coming down hard on a person who is unaware of such a convention is carrying ‘political correctness’ too far and making such a person uncomfortable simply antagonizes them and does not advance a common understanding.
As for their belief that cross-dressing is immoral, I do not feel that they have any rational reason for believing so. If fact, any behaviour that is relatively harmless should not be define as immoral. Weird, maybe, but so what? I would except aesthetic atrocities which can be harmful in that they can be egregiously offensive, but the line between Art and the sort of Trash that motivates one to regurgitate one’s French fries can be a fine one.
So, basically, I do not like to use the word ‘moral’ for behaviour that should be acceptable as it seems based on irrationality and personal perceptions rather than on a more ubiquitously agreed upon and objective measure of benefits versus harm.
Deviancy is also regarded in the sense of ‘normal’. As far as I can see, ‘normal’ means two things.
First it refers to a statistically defined norm. That is something is deemed ‘normal’ if most people do it. However, I feel that some things that are commonly done we can well do without. Also, in any statistical situation the number of people who are ‘normal’ is actually generally a small segment of the general group. Some people are only 0.6 metres tall. Some people are 2.6 metres tall. The usual range of people is between 1.5 metres and 1.8 meters. But that does not mean that the people outside the latter range are ‘deviant’ and there are likely enough persons outside of that range to take in a significant portion of the general population. There are likely instances where something is considered ‘normal’ but which applies to less than 50% of the general population. (I can’t think of a cogent example so I will let you do that.) So, in a sense, those who are ‘normal’ are actually not normal as they do not make the majority, just a sizeable plurality.
Secondly ‘normal’ seems to be a term psychologists use to define their concepts of moral but to still seem to be scientifically objective. A clever ruse, but are they really fooling anyone?
So I do not like ‘moral’ and I do not like ‘normal’ because of the negative and pejorative connotations and because their usage seems more harmful than necessarily as being arbitrarily excluding and punitive.
In the television series, “Cheers”, there was a character, Norm, who sat a bar and consumed beverages. A similar character appeared the the series, “Star Trek: Deep Space Nine”. The creators of the latter series made a nodding homage to the former by naming the latter character Morn. So:
I take moral and normal and compress them into mornal which has some of the characteristics of both but there is a difference. First, I remove the judgemental elements of moral and keep the ethical element of behaviour that is minimally harmful and even beneficial and therefore acceptable. Second, I remove the necessity of numerical prevalence so that ‘mornal’ behaviour may be unusual but still rational, meaningful and even aesthetically stimulating.
So mornal behaviour may be ‘deviant’ in the sense that one follows a road less traveled, dances to the beat of a different drum, lets their freak flag fly, explores new ideas or old ones in new ways, is inventive, questioning and above all self-actuallizing. But frankly I would rather be deviant and mornal rather than some other people’s ideas of moral or normal which are, too often, too normal and not all that moral.
- November 20, 2020 at 5:34 pm #408914AimeeParticipantRegistered On: September 13, 2020Topics: 0Replies: 1Has thanked: 0 timesBeen thanked: 7 times
Thanks for posting. My ex wife would have definitely said the same thing as yours said to you. Good thing for me that she never figured out that I was cross-dressing.
I have felt a lot of shame over my past crossdressing and thought it was deviant only to really discover it’s ok. My current wife accepts me dressing as Aimee. So no, crossdressing is not deviant.
- November 20, 2020 at 6:08 pm #408921ParticipantRegistered On: August 9, 2020Topics: 6Replies: 59Has thanked: 74 timesBeen thanked: 298 times
Thank you Aimee and Stephanie!
I have come to the realization that my cross dressing is not deviant nor immoral. The fact that I prefer women’s clothes over male clothes does not change the person inside of me. With the exception that I’m happier as Lexie!
While I’ve only been cross dressing for a relatively short time, approximately 4-5 years, I’ve come to the conclusion that I’m happier when dressed en-femme! Many of my co-workers have commented on the fact that when I’m Lexie, I’m happier, more engage with my work.
Although my wife does not understand, nor do I think she wants to, this is a part of ME! My wife and I are very conservative Christian couple, but I do not feel that God is going to send me to Hell because of the choice of clothing that I wear. Although he may not approve, I feel that he still loves me, and can ‘overlook’ this.
I have found that this community is very supportive, and although I do not always agree with everyone here all the time, the perspectives they bring forward give one “good for thought” shall I say!
- November 20, 2020 at 4:38 pm #408891
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