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Hi all
thank you everyone who is on this site for your compassion, warmth, honesty and support
I thought this would be a quick request for ideas and help but warning it is very long ….. if you read and have any advice for me I would be really grateful
I am a long term partner ( 30 years) and co parent. My partner told me a year ago that he is a CD – he told me by coming into the room I was in fully dressed. I was shocked as it was totally unexpected to me but realised this was a fragile and important moment and did my best to be supportive, even putting lipstick on him and giving him clothes to try. We went out a couple of times with him partly dressed. The CD is not an issue for me in fact I find it interesting and fun – although I am not in any way a girly girl and not into makeup or ‘feminine’ things so while I am excited for him to explore that , getting excited about dressing up is not very authentic to me. But the issue is that I found myself really struggling with the fact that this had been such a closely guarded secret our whole relationship and questioned what that meant about him, us, honesty, trust. We talked about this alot and I understand his fear in telling me but I feel betrayed and this has really deeply undermined my trust in ways I am finding it hard to come back from. The fact that he was actively exploring his CD for our whole relationship ( with different levels of engagement ) and I never knew spins me out – that he is capable of keeping something that secret. and that I had totally no idea.
He has also been struggling with depression , probably for many years but in particular in the last 2 years and this has been hard ( mainly for him of course but also for people around him )
Since the start of this year and his ‘ coming out’ many other things have happened and the CD ( according to him ) sort of faded which he says is his pattern. I feel like it is up to him and not me to lead communication around this so I wait and wait and then eventually ask him about it. I am unsure of my ‘rights’ – what is it ok for me to expect to know?
Fast forward to the last couple of weeks when he has suddenly become very ‘alive’ and happy. his habit has been for many years to go walking sometimes for hours late at night. sometimes dressed. I know this. and we had agreed at the start of the year that he would tell me if he was going out and when he would-be back. apart from anything else I hold concern for his safety walking round in the middle of the night dressed up in a not particularly accepting town.
Last week he went out to meet a friend for a drink before dinner and as he was leaving said to me ( I was on the phone ) ‘ I might not be home for dinner’ and then there were a series of texts between us where he drip fed what he was doing and then said that had wanted to tell me that he was really enjoying CD again and wanted to be able to explore that. All I needed really was some clarity about when he might be home but I ended up feeling like a nagging and demanding wife as I lay there for a long time waiting to hear from him and then texted him – more times than he was comfortable with ( for context this was 4 times over 7 hours) . The next night there was a similar situation where he went out and was unclear about time in particular. he did tell me he was ok and what he was doing but bit by bit and I was awake until 430am when he got home.
I was really impacted by the lack of clarity and communication and it completely reignited my fear and vulnerability and lack of feeling of trust and safety which I thought i had worked through but clearly haven’t. I also felt – and feel – disrespected and that I am not been treated with kindness. We have talked about this.
Our story now is that he ( at his wish) has moved into a seperate part of our house which is stand alone where he can have his own space to explore and be who and how he wants to be. This is something he has wanted for a long time and the circumstances of 2020 have made it hard ( children coming home etc). This is for a time frame at the moment.
I am really struggling. I unequivocally support him and want him to be able to be fully himself in whatever that means, and I know he doesnt know what that means right now and is working it out. But I feel like this is all on his terms, that if he wants to continue to be a partner with me ( which he says he does) that it feels dissonant that he is doing this in a way which totally excludes me ( and does include others) . He also says he wants to renegotiate , or work out , or change, what our relationship is. Me too as there are lots of things in it that aren’t ideal but I am feeling very destabilised and that this is all on his terms.
I want to be present, compassionate, supportive and honest and I love the idea of being able to have a deeper and more real relationship but I am caught in feelings of anger and fear. I don’t know what is my ‘right’ to ask or expect. I don’t know how or where to process my feelings about this – I respect that CD is his story to tell and so i havent talked about it with people in my life as they are common friends and I think this would betray him.
so he is ‘living’ in another part of the house, asking to be unanswerable to me for a period of time, still being a household member and parent but with some clear boundaries with me ( and he works hard at this and does alot of labour in particular with my dad who is struggling with aging and lives with us). he has talked to our son who is still at home but I am not really sure what he has told him and this doesnt feel ok to me , i want us to to clear and honest. ( in fact when he told me about CD at the start of the year I was all up for this being a public part of his/our life, and that is much more comfortable for me – but not for him – or not then – maybe not ever) this is part of a confusion for me, this is his story but it is also my story and what can I do with that? And while he is in another physical space he is not removed from my heart and mind I am lying awake all night unable to sleep with anxiety that I cannot even name. I want to be able to get clear about my needs at this time, and what is reasonable to ask for. And if he can’t meet them then I can make some decisions about what I need to do. I know this is a time of change and I need to find some patience and ability to allow and sit in the space but its really hard.
This is not just about CD for him ( or for me / us) but about lots of things .
If anyone here has any words of wisdom for me i would be deeply grateful. Just writing this has been helpful for me so thank you for creating the space to be able to share.
love to all
I’m so sorry your going through this turmoil Davida. It seems to me you’ve been understanding and patient to a fault with your husband, frankly from what you’ve described I’m struggling to feel any sympathy for him at all. I suffer from depression as well, coming out to my wife earlier this year has certainly helped alleviate that for me, but I wouldn’t use that as a crutch, or ever dream of treating my wife the way your husband has. He should not have shocked you by strolling in fully dressed like that, he should not be going out for long periods incommunicado, and you should not be forced to lie in bed wondering what the hell is going on. Do you think you could get him to join up here? There’s no reason why he should refuse you if you were to ask him to do so in an effort to make this new reality better for the both of you.
Wow. Big journey. Give yourself permission to vent, lament, and grieve.
He is using your acceptance of his crossdressing, as being consent for really bad behaviour.
I’m deeply conservative when it comes to marriage. No flirting, meeting others clandestinely is taboo. Protecting your marriage is paramount. Watching your partners back is essential.
Good on you for wanting to work through his cd’ing. My wife and I are doing that very thing.
Going on ‘secret’ dates with others isn’t ok. Which is what it appears he is doing.
It sounds like you have a substantial sized house. I’d be kicking him out myself, or if you, going to your mothers. 😉 I’d be extremely cautious sexually, and it could be wise to get checked for stds. (Sorry to sound glum.) Id also clearly set the boundaries with him, no play, until he too has been checked.
I know some couples have open relationships, but I’m yet to see any that really work and last the distance. Its my observation they tend to be destructive.
You sound like a nice lady. Your husband sounds like he is a jerk. Hugs and prayers.
Hi Davida,
I have read your story, and I will re -read it again, but in the meantime I just want to make these comments. Firstly well done for trying to support your husband, many of us are not so lucky. However it is clear that your husband neither understands or appreciates how difficult it is for you to do this. On top to that it is obvious that he is very self centred putting his crossdressing before everything else. He didn’t use the best method the explain his crossdressing to you, a little more compassion and low key would have worked better, but you went with it and still supported him. However it seems he has used that acceptance as permission to do whatever he wants without considering your needs, your feelings and your rights. I have to say I think you are going to have a very hard time, and you are going to have to make some difficult decisions if your partnership is to continue. He will have to make a lot of concessions because you have the right to be treated properly and with respect, that clearly is not the case at the moment. I do wish you the very best for the future, if you want to continue this conversation, by all means PM me, I will be happy to chat to you………………
thank you – this is very validating. I have been questioning whether my expectations and reactions are fair and because I can’t talk about it with anyone it’s so hard to have perspective. I could ask him to join here but there is part of me that wants to protect him from the judgement that is here as well! He has alot of self loathing – which doesnt excuse bad behaviour – but I don’t want to feed it… ( i sound like a real enabler here)
You shouldn’t worry about him being judged, the wonderful people here are decidedly non judgmental. We would all love to hear his side of the story, if I did and told him afterwards that I feel what he is doing is wrong or hurtful to you, that is not a judgement but an observation, and if he can’t handle an honest one, he has other issues. Until we can have more to go on my opinion, (Which I hesitated to make in my first post) that I can now see is shared by many others in this thread is to dump his ass onto the curb until he treats you fairly. If its easier for you then you can leave and force his hand to make a choice, you should not be strung along like this, imo that is one of the worst things anyone can do to their partner, right up there with cheating.
Hi Davida
You should consider getting your partner to join here, it will help him as well as you. From my point of view, it’s not about judging your partner it’s about saying what I think is the correct way of doing things. If someone wants to be accepted as a crossdresser then they have to respect the other persons point of view. If you want to support your partner you have to respect their point of view, you may not agree with it but you have to respect it. For you both to move forward with this their needs to be respect on both sides, form what you say, this clearly is not the case at the moment. Your partner needs to up his game and see things from your point of view. In showing respect, it’s not just about accepting you have a different point of view, but also that your needs and desires as far as possible are met. This means compromise, because you are trying to accept your partner it does not give him the right to do what ever he wants, it only means you have started to accept some of what he wants. We live in the real world, ideally I would crossdress every day, but that is not possible, not because I couldn’t do it, but because I have to work within the structure myself and partner have. So respect is the key, it’s not the answer, it’s just the starting point.
You say your partner has a lot of self loathing, sometimes this is also due to respect, lack of respect for himself. This sometimes comes about because the crossdresser feels guilty for what he is doing, now assuming it’s only crossdressing, then their is nothing to feel guilty about once you accept that this is part of you, but often it’s there under the surface, and it will not go away until he fully accepts who he really is (he possibly does not know at the moment). But as you rightly say this is not an excuse for his actions……………..
Thank you for being you, Davida, you truly do sound like a gem, and, Im sorry but your Husband is an ass.
I agree with previous statements, it sounds like he is cheating on you, and using the cd as an excuse for really un thinkable behavior.
Please, please, follow Cindy Lou’s advice, protect yourself, here,
Huge hugs,
Regi.Hi Davida, you sound like an amazing lady and the way you are supporting your partner a lot of us can only dream of. All of us understand the difficulties of being a cross dresser but that doesn’t give anyone the right to disrespect and take advantage of the ones that love and support us, a relationship is a two way street. I think you’re partner needs to pull their head in and realize how lucky they are. Davida , I hope everything works out for you and your partner. Dani👩🏻🔧
thank you everyone for your responses and care. It is great to feel heard and have some other perspectives. This is just my version of our story and he would probably tell it very differently. He has told me that he is not having sex with anyone else, and he wouldn’t unless we had talked about it first, and I choose to believe this. Our sex life is pretty dormant ( this predates this year and is due to my lack of interest in sex) and I have recognised that this is not fair to him – once again an issue that predates any talk or my knowledge of CD. I think he is doing the best he can but I do think that he is behaving without respect and selfishly. thank you to others for saying this as I feel understood. this really is an amazing group, I have been reading many other people’s stories and it is very helpful to me. x
I’ve read & re-read your letter & am still trying to digest it–I'[m trying to figure out what type of relationship you had Before you found out–What was Good/Bad or even ugly about your marriage /relationship -your lovelife ect ect– I “Could” jump to conclusions, however that could be more harmful than helpful to you & him– The part that jumped out at me was him segregating himself–but mabe there is something I don’t know– I’d like to give some meaningful advice to you but can’t with So much info missing-
Hi Davida
Wow! A supportive s/o. You are a real treasure, honey, and he should consider himself blessed.
Depression associated with constant hiding of CD tendencies seems common – when I first truly discovered that I like to wear women’s clothing, I was so horrified that I tried to commit suicide, and lived with depression for many decades on and off.
2 years after coming out, it’s pretty much lifted, and I am in the best place mentally that I have ever been.
The secrecy is not unusual – we’re so scared of losing our s/o’s by telling them, and live in doom-laden hope that we can just give it up until the day we realise that we actually can’t, and need to tell someone.
Who better than the person closest to us?
That took real nerve, and trust.
Unfortunately, the years of holding it all back act like a pressure cooker – we want it all, we want to throw ourselves into this now we’re out, and acceptance can have this drawback that brings out the selfish aspect, as we realise that, OK, the dresses are nice, but we need a wig, some makeup, some shoes, more shoes – can you ever have enough – the whole Imelda Marcos thing… It’s like the dam has burst.
But the truth is that it is a 2-way street.
I see this phrase used and abused – but the truth is, he needs to think about you more than ever, because girl, you are very special, and he needs to treat you that way!
Send him to us!!!
It’s terribly easy, in the rush of acceptance, to forget who made coming out such a lovely experience. The first thing the girl/boy child wants is more, more, more.
I am not saying it’s right, but that he’s probably not aware of it, and it’s probably best heard from others who have been through it – although, in my case, I only have my own acceptance, and boy, did I go on a spree!!
I realised, from my wife’s reactions, that she was scared of losing me as a husband, perhaps feeling threatened by the “New woman” in our relationship.
So I set out to be the best husband I could be, in the hope that one day…
Boundaries are necessary in any relationship – it’s all about compromise, and the necessary politics in ensuring that comes about, or arguments are inevitable.
The wives section section of this site should provide a lot of good support – I hope this view from the other side is helpful.
Love Laura
Thank you Laura
Yes I really agree with and understand the courage and trust it took to share CD with me, especially after holding the secret for so long. I can hold this feeling and my own feelings of betrayal together.
I think it is hard for him to think about me and my needs right now – he is doing his best but his priority (he says) is to look after and get clear about himself in order to be able to be his best self with others. I get that. But I am struggling with what is happening right now.
It is so good to hear stories like yours of people who have been liberated from depression by coming out. I truly hope for him wherever this journey takes him it frees him from that suffering.
Thank you again x
Hi, me again – there’s so much to unpack in your post, I want to advise one more thing:
This will take time, so prepare yourself for the long haul (and I wish you the speediest resolution!).
This jumped out at me like Lord Voldemort:
“…anxiety that I cannot even name. I want to be able to get clear about my needs…”
Getting names for your anxieties is like being able to say Voldemort instead of “He who must not be named”.
Give them names, and you have a handle on them – you’re a step closer to defeating them, thus becoming clearer about your needs.
I find myself saying this to CDs wanting to come out, dealing with the many difficulties and obstacles we face – baby steps.
Every time – no matter what, if you’re unsure, and feeling your way through new territory, don’t run headlong at it.
I expect there are people who might advise otherwise – it’s all advice, based on opinions, and I truly hope you take the advice that gets you to where you need to be.
Hi, Davida.
Thank you for taking the time to come here and ask for information. I am sure that others will praise you for doing so but it is difficult to express just how much it means to us.
She should not have suddenly revealed her predilection to being feminine by suddenly appearing ‘dressed’. That must have been extremely disorientating for you. I mean, how do you respond? On the other hand, she deserves credit for trying to be honest with you and trusting you that much. Generally I advise that, when making such a reveal, one might have photos available if asked for but that suddenly appearing in a feminine presentation can be traumatic to the person to whom they are revealing themselves. So, don’t feel bad if your reaction may not have been quite what you wanted to be. As for your feeling of lack of trust and betrayal, really, set that aside. It’s normal, even usual, but even after a 30-year lapse it can be a major effort so I would see it as a bit (a little bit) complimentary. Some cross-dressers never, ever tell their spouses. Still, communication is essential and, from now on, you do have a right to be fully aware of all events and developments. Your concerns, for example, for her (and yours as well) safety are very much valid.
I am concerned that you write, “… I am not in any way a girly girl and not into makeup or ‘feminine’ things….” The thing is, some people are almost driven by necessity to be feminine and some of those people just happen to be male. Mostly it is females, but not always. This may make, for you, understanding why any male would want to be a woman (not necessarily female) more difficult to understand. On the other hand, you do highlight the fact that many people do not feel the compulsion to be especially feminine and that many such persons are also female. Something we lose sight of something that is important. That is, femininity can be a terrible burden for some and a necessity for others.
I suspect that many cross-dressers struggle with depression to varying degrees. I know that I do and it is very possible that cross-dressing is partially a response to depression giving one at least a temporary sense of euphoria and a sense of self-worth not otherwise possible.
You seem to indicate that a sexual aspect to his cross-dressing is not yet an issue. Should it become relevant I would recommend that you use this forum to express your concerns. I really cannot think of a better place apart from a therapist who is actually conversant with the issues. I have seen anywhere from 10-15 forums, blogs, etc. dealing with cross-dressing over the past two decades and this seems to be the most rational so far.
My own points-of-view, concepts, beliefs and ideas diverge significantly from ‘popular’ notions so this is not the best time to expound upon them. However, I can offer some ways of looking at things that might give you alternatives if you need them. Above all:
Don’t Panic!
Araminta.
Thank you Araminta
I really appreciate the time you have taken and all you have written
Don’t panic is great advice!
I agree that it was courageous to share CD with me and I expressed that , and have expressed that , to him. Part of the story is that he says that he had tried to tell me 2 times before and I responded negatively. I have absolutely no memory of this, which does not mean it didn’t happen but is very strange and would be out of character for me – I tend to be hyper aware of what others are saying or feeling.
I understand the secrecy but my feeling of mistrust is about the fact that this big thing was so hidden from me , that I was totally unaware of it – what else is hidden? How can I feel trust into the future- about many things- knowing this? I am holding both these feelings at the same time – compassion and understanding for the holding of the secret and the bravery in sharing it, and anger, betrayal and fear about what that means.
One of my dilemmas now is exactly what you said – what right do I have to be fully aware and informed ? he is saying that there are things he does not want to, or does not feel safe, to share. This is hard for me and also hard to know what is appropriate for me to ask for
Yes I probably don’t understand the drive / need to be feminine because it is not something I share, but that is ok for me – I can appreciate and understand that people have many different ways of expressing themselves. It’s more that the idea of ‘playing’ in this space – with whatever that might mean, high heels, make up, perfume – is not interesting to me. I’m not attracted to that ( not repelled by it ) . Not to say I am not attracted to women but those aspects of expression of femininity are not something that I personally enjoy ( and in fact as a feminist find challenging for women)
And yes, I guess there is a connecting between CD and depression but I also think it is not up to me to determine that – it is his call
There are issues for us with sex in general so this will of course be part of it. I really appreciate this forum as a way of thinking about that.
Any other thoughts are so welcome
I am really sorry that you have been so disrespected and hurt.
There is no room in a healthy relationship for secrets, for him to come out to you as he did and than continue behaving selfishly and secretly is reprehensible (in my opinion.)I came out badly to my wife, but it was with the intention of clearing the air and building something better and stronger.
Based on your post, he will continue to take from you until you stop it. Marriage equals partnership and you don’t sound like you’re getting much in the way of love, kindness or respect.
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