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As strictly an occasional crossdresser I also love my male side. There are parts of maleism in certain situations that I abhor. One is a privateish gathering of three or more males.Which happened as we raked the front yard yesterday. MMPMPC?!?!?
M – macho
M – male(ish)
P – potty
M – mouth
P – pissing
C – contest
Believe me as one of three brothers from small-town Ontario I can F-bomb and potty mouth like a five whiskeys Rambo, and I joined in. I was worried that I had pushed things a little far and one might have caught on that I was actually ridiculing them. But then again, in true maleish insecurity…they all at least pretended to buy it. I did get the “you kiss you momma with that mouth?” comment…
Why do men define their gender with crudite?.
The thing is I am certain at least one of them might have coveted that silky pink teddy/camisole I got off of Amazon last week…
How are you a faking macho?
Talk (sweetly) amongst yourselves…
I work in a very macho industry, mineral exploration, lots of hard core geologists and grizzled old prospectors and a few very talented female geologists. I am happy to say that on projects I have been involved in people are generally respected and accepted as part of the team based upon their skill and work ethic, regardless of gender or orientation. There is a lot of macho behavior, but I have never felt any pressure to be a part of it and I don’ t think it has cost me anything personally or professional. I have found that people often come to me if they have personal problems and I am always open to talk stuff over with co-workers.
Hi Harietta, I can never pull off being macho. I’ve had a babyface my whole life, I can’t grow any facial hair if my life depended on it, no Adam’s apple, smallish in stature, I’ve been mistaken for female dressed totally in drab. I dislike the coarse and crude language used by groups of males. I guess that’s why I’ve always preferred the company of woman. I tried being macho when I was younger – joined the gun club, participated in martial arts (even won a nice big trophy), play ice hockey and football. But no luck, I never came across as macho.
Grew up in Southern Ontario as well, but moved west after I graduated from University. Love being close to the Rocky Mountains. Fantastic hiking and skiing.
Stay healthy, stay safe, Hugs, Krista
No, I never could pull it off. I’ve always had a feminine lilt in my voice and my body language just screams it too. I used to work in the steel industry and used to love watching the gorillas playing who’s the most manly, I love playing fly on the wall and watching human behaviour. It can be very educational and quite entertaining at the same time. Another one of my favourites is sitting in a bar about midnight on a Saturday night and watching the human courtship rituals, this gets down right hilarious.
IMHO, it all depends on who one chooses to hang out with.
Prior to political correctness becoming the standard in the US Navy and Marine Corps, the “F” word was standard vocabulary, but -all- “men defining their gender with crudite”? I cannot agree with that. Before the “F” word became politically incorrect in the Navy, some sailors would use it more than others, while some sailors would not use it at all.
Post Navy, my civilian career was with a federal regulatory agency. I experienced very little “crudite” working there. However, there were exceptions.
I am totally macho at work. 3 minutes from tone out to we are out the door in truck. I am 75% maybe feminine at home but if problem comes up I think very fast and I am decisive in actions! I have never been a beer drinking bubba!
Do have to ask are female firefighters masculine? I know 2 and they can do same job as me! Have to apply with law enforcement and other first responders!. The ones I know are married and I don’t approach their gender identity
Never been able to hang with gorillas. The MMPMPC thing has always been a turn off, and I assume men that carry that swagger are dolts or morons. Do I use profanity? Of course, but my now unrestricted feminine side doesn’t abide it at all, and my male side uses it in private only, reserving it for home projects gone wrong, finding dog turds in the closet, or imbecilic political views. I tell my students that although language like that may be part of their home vernacular, others in class find the language frightening and threatening, as I always have.
No machismo BS here, but, on the flip side, my girl side can talk naughty for hours (but that’s for another post! 😂).Great question! Loving the responses. Stay beautiful, girls! Love ❤️
Tj
Not “Western” I hope. I thougtht friends didn’t let their friends go to Western….ha….ha
Although London has far better bars with live music than Ottawa.
No macho here.
Anglo-Saxon expletives were never my thing. and I tend to label those who depend on them for emphasis as being illiterate clods. As a guy, I’m very much a Clark Kent, except for very rare occasions when something triggers me; and the less said about that, the better.
I knew I could never be ‘macho’, so I never really tried. I decided that ‘Average Joe’s’ was my calling for my outward façade, so I worked at being just average and fitting in. My awakening to crudite behavior came when I switched schools coming into 4th grade as we moved to a neighboring elementary school district (new friends, new neighborhood, but same town). First day at a new school and an awful lot of boys had their left hand covering their privates and their right hand sticking out in sort a cup with fingers extended, and threatening to ‘goose’ any boy that didn’t immediately cover up. Wow! My first thought was ‘we moved here? I wanna go back to a sane neighborhood’. There were enough boys in all my classes starting in junior high (not the more politically correct ‘middle school’) and especially H.S. where in gym class we were on occasion divided by supposed physical ability. I strived to be in the middle group and mostly succeeded. One of my high points was to win my gym class Indian leg wrestling contest. I astounded the PE teacher. I understood leverage overcomes strength better than the others. Kept that understanding the rest of my life.
Hi Harietta,
I’ve never desired to fit amongst the chest thumping males , despite being involved with professional & semi pro body contact sports for 20 yrs. I didn’t not fit in , just not interested in any pissing competitions , nor wanting to be an embarrassment to myself.
I got by fine, enjoyed myself & just avoided the Alphas , it’s been the same since retirement from competitive sports. I’m simply not interested in ” big boys toys ” & who has the biggest p&#@s 💐💐 Tiff
Its not faking it, he’s still in here and I’m good with that. I’ve never been one to overuse expletives but not scared of them either. As a contractor, when the hammer slips or my head hits a rafter a simple squeaky owie! or jeepers just ain’t gunna cut it. I’m fairly confident that I could talk my way through most encounters with any lughead who really doesn’t agree with my clothing choice but if not, I’m not petite and if necessary there are other ways to get my point accross in order to leave.
I’d say when I was younger I tried to fake being macho. I was in bands with guys who instead on looking tough and I won’t deny I tried to fit in. And some people complimented me on how a portrayed myself on stage, like a man. To be honest I’m not even sure how I pulled that off. I do confess I still have a potty mouth when frustrated, but otherwise, I don’t like faking being macho these days. I just want to be me regardless of what mode I’m in male or female.
I never was the macho kind of guy, avoided the confrontations most of the times and for some reason they always left me alone, even when I was on the technical school, boys only and they always tried to get under you skin and provoke you to do something stupid.
Later in life I met with an old school mate and we talked about our time on the technical school and he mentioned that most guy’s left me alone because I was wearing a denim jacket with on the back a large sticker from Bruce Lee, I am a big fan of him and all his movies yes but are not a martial artist, but apparently a lot of guys thought I was and so left me alone.
Later when I worked in the merchant navy there was a colleague who wanted to arm wrestle, and his arms were twice the size of mine, so he asked me to give it a try and yes you guessed it already he lost, maybe that’s the only time I was a bit of a macho but did not showed it kept it nicely inside myself, as the humble person I am.
I do work in a male driven/occupied industry and know how to respond to certain situations but still do that on a calm and decent way instead of exploding like some of my colleagues do it’s not in my personality.
Renske
I’m going to be honest, I can act macho but I absolutely hate it. I grew up rural in the Deep South, all my cousins bragged about hunting, fishing, and sports to the point where everybody was in competition with each other. Sad thing is they all still do after we have all grown up. Don’t get me wrong I love being outdoors and I like a good football game but so much is put on being manly and macho to where it effects what we wear, what we drive an so on to the point where if you don’t go along with it, you end up being the butt of derogatory jokes and name calling. I don’t know about y’all but I find it so difficult to enjoy myself with that surrounding. Yes I love the outdoors, I can fish, I can get dirty with the rest of them. I’m a proud veteran and a really good mechanic But more over, even tho I don’t drive a huge truck, or brag about who I went out with last night, or enjoy hunting, I’d rather not be a phony and just be myself. If that means I like to dress femme, and do things that make society nervous and question their own masculinity, then I say who cares? I’m happy and at peace with myself. I’m not in a competition with anyone and honestly we shouldn’t have to. I’m living my dream, if others don’t like that then maybe they are hiding something and not really being true to themselves. At the end of the day, you need to be happy with who you are.
I never thought of me being overly macho but it was my way of life with work, family and being with the boys. Quite out going, sports, outdoors every aspect of our male culture. But through my many years I’ve always had that softer side but ever kept it hidden. Looking what life has dealt me I wouldn’t change a thing but now I feel for me. I don’t believe I was faking it but knowing it wasn’t something that was totally driving me. Now I felt the time has come to move over those male imperfections and start enjoying all that life offers .
Never again that stiff shifting strut but now a slow elegance is my walk , an ease to the soul… 🌷
I think the macho thing depends upon several factors including our genetic makeup along with the environmental conditioning we received when we are young. I come from a strong Germanic/Prussian heritage. I think there is a bit of genetic macho that goes with that. But I was also raised in a chaotic household that featured much fighting and little to no love. It took many years for me to understand the macho wall I built up around me to shield myself due to my own insecurities and psychological fear of being hurt by others, after being hurt for such a long time by the ones who should have been been showing love to me. So now, after all these years, I try to avoid acting macho but occasionally the macho tendencies make appearances. It’s tough to subdue the demons at times but I’ll continue to carry on.
Here’s the thing for me. There are literally two opposite sides of myself. Sometimes I want to look and be as delicate and beautiful as Grace Kelly. Other times I want to be as rough and masculine as Gimli.
I don’t understand why I have these two opposites desires in me. I love wearing beautiful vintage dresses. I also have a deep desire to forge metal.
I don’t know why, but that is me.
I like being a guy and always enjoyed doing boy things when I was young. I just always had a love and desire to wear pretty girl’s clothes. I loved wearing stockings, pantyhose, heels and bra since I was 4. I so wanted to have many pairs of my own shoes, pantyhose, bras, panties, stockings, garters, lingerie and pretty dresses. I would look in magazines and department store catalogues, see all those wonderful things and thought of and dreamed of having and wearing them all the time.
When I was 18 and got my own place, I began buying and wearing all those wonderful things I loved and wanted for so long. I ended up getting everything, including wigs and makeup and began going out fully femme.It was wonderful, euphoric, exciting and such a thrill and rush like nothing else.
Still, though, when I was not in my girly attire I enjoyed going out, getting dirty, playing sports and being rough and tumble. I was just a boy who loved clothes that were not considered boy’s clothes. As an adult, I still enjoy being active in the outdoors. But I really do love the excitement thrill and rush of being Patty and being out too. I’m a manly man who loves dressing like a girly girl.
Hi Harietta,
I can pull it off as in instances like you and I work in a very male profession .
mechanics can be very crude I must say.
I think a lot of mean just default to that behavior when confronted with femininity out of self preservation and not knowing how to deal with it,
I think a lot of men like and would be feminine but they are too scared.
we have a transgender at work and bless her heart she is built like a football player .
Tall and broad shoulders very manly build.
The guys I work with make jokes about her amongst them selves ( not to her)
However what I find is they talk about her a lot.
I think a lot of them are fascinated with her.
What do you girls think? am I way off base?
Love Patty
P.S. Harietta,
One time at work I was giving a girl that worked in our office a ride from our work space back to her office.
She saw one of our employees trans am and said That is a Nice Mother F***cker.
I imideiatly thought how unattractive that language made her look.
She motivated me to talk better for sure its just not very attractive in a woman to me.
I hope I don’t offend any one .
I must say I have to watch my mouth working on things I let it fly too much and its a bad habit I need to get out of
Patty
Patty Williams wrote: “She motivated me to talk better for sure its just not very attractive in a woman to me.
I hope I don’t offend any one .”
No offense here, Patty. Occasional coarse language is something you just expect to hear from a guy; but when I hear it come from a woman, it just sounds and feels WRONG, somehow.
Bettylou
It’s not that I don’t have any male interests, but I’ve hated macho my whole life. I had to be taught to cuss by the councilor in summer camp, and it still wasn’t me. When I was young, I would put on the TV on Sunday nights to watch The Wonderful World of Disney. If there was a football game that was running late, my Dad (who wasn’t a sports fan either) might come and ask me “Who am I rooting for?” My answer was always the same. “The clock.” I didn’t understand the rules, only that they just kept stopping the clock.
In school, during the time of the first Ali-Frazier fight, some of the boys would come up to me and ask me who I was rooting for. They kind of made fun of me because I didn’t care, telling me I have to care. But watching two fighters trying to give the other a concussion was never of interest to me.
I don’t put myself in situations of back and forth potty mouth between guys. You asked why they do it, and part of the answer relates to what a former radio host used to ask. “Why do dogs scratch their back side? Because they can.”
As long as people say “Boys will be boys” and accept the potty mouth as “normal” male behavior, it will continue. Not saying anything is akin to acceptance. The only way to stop it is to say something.
I just don’t put myself in a situation where potty mouth is acceptable, and therefore don’t have to deal with it.
Never could do macho…but certainly can do assertive, confident woman to the point I seem bossy or a beeyatch
Sadly, I can do this second nature and it’s abhorrent but still.
I do also have to say, I work with loads of women who can put men in the shade with this type of potty mouthed, loutish behaviour. Even some female psychiatrists I’ve worked with are expert at this. And have you can the gauntlet of calling a group of women ladies. Definitely need to wear a hard hat and ear muffs If I dare do that again.
😂😁😂
Take care girls.
Anne-Marie.
A counter question – can you go to a dance club, strip club, bar, or party and oogle women strictly like many guys do?
I can’t, I seem to have gained too much respect for women as a CD. I’m hetero, and the first things that often jump out to me is how a woman is dressed, her attitude, her demeaner, her femininty. The worst macho situations for me would be when guy friends would want to go to a strip club. The first things that would jump out to me would be, “wow, I like her outfit”, or “I wonder how many inches are those heels”, “gross how all these guys treat her, she’s a lady”.
Same when my wife dresses up sexily or in lingerie. My first thoughts are how good she looks, then followed by I wonder how I would look in an outfit like that, then, wow, she’s up to somethiing.
Hi Harietta. I don’t think that being a potty mouth is a sign of being a macho man. I don’t believe I ever heard my dad ever swear or use any kind of cuss word. He was a mostly quiet man who only said what needed to be said and did what needed to be done. He was a midwest farmer who raised 5 boys which took a lot of hard work. 7 days a week, sometimes 16 hour days during planting and harvest season. I don’t know if you would call this macho or maybe stoic would be more accurate. I sure would not call this anyware near feminine.
I myself can cuss and swear with the best, but I choose not to, and have always tried not to. But starting this year I started to switch to behaving more feminine at work, I started giving my male coworkers a hug before work every day. This has had to go on hold till after the virus scare is over.
Macho? Never could pull that off (nor ever really wanted to). Masculine? I used to be at least okay at appearing “not feminine”. Would never have considered my self as uber masculine in my younger days- and mainly someone ho faded into the woodwork as I was shy and introverted. I’ve gotten more social as Cyn became more of an open and fuller part of my life. And with my hair now well down my back -even when up in a high ponytail-I get gently teased by my friends at league pool as having the best hair in the bar. I also am happy to french braid any girl’s hair if she likes-averaging 2-4 times whenever I’m there. And I know that at least a dozen or two dozen of my friends there know about Cyn and are ok with it.
CynSure, I’m hetero but not made of stone either. I’ll look back when Euridice passes by. But my attraction is never expressed vocally. crudely or otherwise.
I had macho jobs my whole working career. Being in law enforcement and private security I was as macho as my co-workers. When I was in the Army I knew I had to play the macho role. But when I retired I worked at home caring for people. I didnt need the job or the money which wasn’t much. But it was a very rewarding job.
I am of the camp of moderation. I don’t regularly drop any bombs verbally, but am not shy when it adds the needed “flavor” to conversation or informing inanimate objects of your sispleasure of its lack of cooperation. Quick side note I learned years ago. If you are going to inform objects of your displeasure, know the country of manufacture of said object and use the corresponding language for expletives of choice (if it is a Subaru cuss in Japanese) if you don’t do that the object won’t understand your displeasure with it, and therefore will continue to be uncooperative. Just trying to help ladies. Love you all, Elizabeth
Living with my parents and, sometimes, working as an engineer make me play the macho role most of the time.
I’d say there are, at least, two personas inside me: the macho, who curses, swears, drinks a lot and thinks/says a lot of dirty things; and the girl, who loves heels, dresses, makeup, accessories and who would love to walk on the streets like a model. The main issue is how often I show up those personas (the former is shown up far more often than the latter), but I understand the circumstances and, in the end, I try to do my best.
xoxo
Daisy
No need to “fake it”…
When in boy clothes, I’m Mr Macho(my wife says so).
She was actually relieved when I came out as a CD. She was “worried that all there was to you is the macho masculine side”
And when I’m at work, I’m large and in charge. I’m a direct, let’s get this done, assholes and elbows boys…kind of lead by example Field Engineer…
So no faking it…lol
I find myself ever more annoyed with the excessive use of the F bomb. “F” this and “F” that and F, F, F… some peoples vocabulary appears limited to this one adjective.
Hey, I will use it on occasion, but more in a light hearted joking way a la George Carlin (RIP). The one thing that brings out my very foul language is animal abuse. Then I could make anyone blush and cringe. And of course being in the Forces as a teenager taught me to cuss with the best of them. Actually, it was required to curse and abuse recruits in those days …
Stevie
Served 22 years active duty in the U.S. Navy. Saw many wannabe macho – Rambo types. They made the worst leaders, all mouth, and when the bad guys start shooting at you, suddenly everyone is diving for cover, including the macho – Rambo types. The most effective leaders I know were the calm, cool, collected, quiet type. When they walked in a room, they did not have to say anything. Everybody knew right away, this guy is the boss. A big “however,” when I left the military and entered the civilian work force, I soon found out you cannot trust anyone, and everyone will stick a knife in your back and laugh, a big change that took me a while to adjust to.
I worked at a historical park for 5 summers when I was a student (it was a kitchen job, so our interaction with park guests was minimal). Before then I would occassionally swear, but nothing excessive.
When I started working at the park, the sous chef would drop F bombs like nobody’s business. F this, F that, F you, …. Well after the first summer I picked up on that and began incorporating F into my vocabulary. By the last summer, I could surpass him in dropping F bombs.
After I left and took jobs more towards my career, my potty mouth subsided, as it wasn’t professional to start swearing in an office setting.
Well, after so many years and now at my current job, the F bombs have crept back. It is ironic because in a school setting which is dominated by politically correct liberal types, I swear worse than a sailor.
Interesting thoughts to ponder here, Harietta.
I was a lonely nerd growing up, sucked at sports, sensitive, cried easily, often bullied and called a sissy many times. Pretty much the opposite of macho, I suppose. Oh, yeah – and I was painfully shy, especially around girls. I can’t say that I was overly girly acting or anything like that, just a skinny nerdy kid that did discover the beautiful feeling of wearing girls clothes at a young age when I tried on my mom’s and sisters’ stuff.
I joined the Army a few months after high school when I couldn’t find a decent job and my mom and I weren’t getting along particularly well. Had to learn to be a bit macho to survive in that environment, but I guess that came more easily than I thought it would (testosterone at high levels at 18?). Always kept my crossdressing secret throughout my life and I am pretty certain that most people that know me would absolutely freak out if they knew I liked to wear women’s clothes, so I guess I don’t have any trouble appearing “manly”. That said, I don’t like that side of me sometimes. I prefer my softer side and I am just glad that I have this avenue to help keep the male side from getting overly strong influence over my total persona.
I can’t stand the stereotypical macho-man bullshit. Never could even long before I ever started crossdressing. I’ve never had any desire to act like that, not to “fit in” or “because I’m a guy” (honestly, I’m pretty convinced at this point that the old “I can’t help it, I’m a guy” is 100% every time just a guy who knows he’s being a jerk using that as an excuse to get off easy) or anything.
I’ve always had difficulty getting along with guys for this reason. I sometimes get along okay with guys in the more nerdy/geeky/etc. category, but even then there’s sometimes creepy comments that make the conversation just shut down until somebody changes the subject. And whenever there’s a group of guys all talking (in my past experiences it was high school guys first, then later college-age ones; after that age I’ve generally just avoided ever being around groups of guys just sitting around talking) you tend to eventually loop around to the gross conversations about whatever girls they find attractive. What I’ve half-jokingly called the “hurr hurr she’s hot” talk. Except of course it’s usually way more graphic and disrespectful than just that.
For so much of my life, literally every time I overheard guys talking about girls they were attracted to, the conversation was so creepy, gross, and disrespectful that I actually had to pop out into the hallway and congratulate two guys I overheard in college talking about one of the two’s ex-girlfriend — because even though the relationship hadn’t ended on great terms, they were both actually being respectful about it and not being creeps or insulting the poor girl (she had her own issues she was dealing with which probably were part of what led to the relationship collapsing.)
So… yeah, I don’t have a macho-man act. I can’t fake it and I’ve certainly never been like that for real. And I’ve never wanted to!
Dear Harietta;
I really don’t know how to answer this one. I can swear a blue streak when I need to, but I’m only ever acting when I try to go ‘full on macho’. It doesn’t come naturally and I’ve only ever done it when I think that I need to do it for self preservation reasons (and then do my best not to be in the same situation again).
The same reaction has been used to go hyper aggressive when I’ve felt physically threatened, but inside Molly is in the corner whimpering, so it’s never a pretty sight, especially since I’m nowhere near intimidating physically. (I think this is an unfortunate result of childhood bullying… The bullies tended to find more predictable targets once they’d pushed it too far in the physical realm)
In short, I feel quite silly when I’ve felt I had to engage in the pissing contests, and invariably wonder why I thought I needed to do that when it happens, and much more so, “Why didn’t anyone call me on the lousy acting job?”
Have I done it? ‘Yes’, but only when I felt I had to, and always try to disengage as quickly as possible.
Has it worked for me? I don’t think it did, but no one has ever called me on it to my face, so I feel that I need to answer “No”.
I’m not a true Alpha male, and when it’s not about something that I actually care about deeply, I don’t feel compelled to correct or educate someone who’s wanting to be Alpha, so I simply ignore them…. Most who have tried get pretty frustrated when I don’t play the game, but occasionally I slip if I find them particularly annoying.
I do not engage in the crude talking about women past the point of agreeing that some girl/lady/woman looks good, because past that, it appears that I’m just not wired to express that way.
After a certain point in life, I found that I can project a certain ‘intensity’ of being (as described by more people than I care to count) that can be quite intimidating for those who have to deal with me when I need to, and they often seem to get the message that we’re stepping into territory that may not be good to be in. Since it’s been described as both “being in trouble with your Dad” and “being in trouble with your Mum”, I’m not sure if Macho is the way to describe it
-Molly
I answered yes, but with caveats.
when I am in “male”, im very much male, not macho. but assertive, and strong willed-mannered.
Im not aggressive, but don’t cross me. I had anger issues when young, maybe from being bullied in adolescence?
I dont swear much, even around other men unless im mad, I was taught not to, out of respect
So, Macho? maybe, but definitely masculine.
But when I change, I change completely. As someone else stated, my wife loves it, because I have been “male” for so many years, she cant get over my other side.
RegineI answered ‘yes’. When I am in male-mode I try to act ‘male’ and hide my natural tendencies towards femininity. However, the act doesn’t come easily and ultimately I find it extremely draining to sustain for any length of time. It’s always been that way for me and throughout my life I’ve found it easier to simply avoid such gatherings and spend time either by myself or with the (other) girls/ladies.
Rachel xx
I’m sad to say I have and did on a daily basis at work.
However, in the last few years leading up to finally acknowledging Rei I’ve made a conscious and concerted effort to shut the heck up in most situations, and the need to ‘bond or blend’ into those groups and situations has melted away.
When the occasional need arises though……..
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